Concept SFFtime presents: N-ATX - 14 L case with ATX mbo and psu, 4-slot gpu and 360mm rad support!

riba2233

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Did you get your 1st prototype yet?
Not yet, but should be soon.

Did you include mounting support for a res/pump?
Hm, I would like to but there are a few challenges. There are many different pumps with different mounts, and there are few possible locations. So TBH I don't even know where to start.
 

Kit

Average Stuffer
Nov 2, 2019
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You could support one particular type of pump/res and also sell that on your site?

I appreciate it's a minefield though on a SFF case as all it takes is one weird componant like the msi trio x 2080ti (custom shape PCB) and it might not fit
 

duynguyenle

Airflow Optimizer
Aug 20, 2019
246
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I don't think it's particularly worthwhile funneling down to one particular pump. First off, not everyone may have access to that particular parts, and considering how open-ended and flexible this case is, there's too many potential hardware combinations/mounting locations to consider. For example, offering a mount between the PSU and motherboard will funnel people towards ITX boards, while being of no use for people who use ATX boards. Or, having the pump mount on the lower side of the case may restrict GPU length and/or get in the way of 120mm rad mounting.

I think it's better to let the customer figure out what spacing is available for their own very specific combination of hardware, and drill holes exactly where they want the mounts to be. Offering one or two prescribed mounts for one specific pump may potentially limit the flexibility for people who have no plans to use that specific mount or may limit space/clearance for their own choice of hardware.
 

Kit

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Nov 2, 2019
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I don't think it's particularly worthwhile funneling down to one particular pump. First off, not everyone may have access to that particular parts, and considering how open-ended and flexible this case is, there's too many potential hardware combinations/mounting locations to consider. For example, offering a mount between the PSU and motherboard will funnel people towards ITX boards, while being of no use for people who use ATX boards. Or, having the pump mount on the lower side of the case may restrict GPU length and/or get in the way of 120mm rad mounting.

I think it's better to let the customer figure out what spacing is available for their own very specific combination of hardware, and drill holes exactly where they want the mounts to be. Offering one or two prescribed mounts for one specific pump may potentially limit the flexibility for people who have no plans to use that specific mount or may limit space/clearance for their own choice of hardware.
I think I typed that he could supply the pump on his site which would negate pump availability (are the cases sold on any other sites?) and I also don't think anyone else has typed that he should support one location/configuration, the mount could also be easily detachable/relocatable (or not used) just like the modular nature of the case.
 

riba2233

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Thank you all for the ideas! It is too early for me to offer 3rd party products on my store, but I will try to at least put some slots on two locations on the case, so you can at least have a few options for mounting pumps, and if you need more, you can always drill extra, shouldn't be a problem in 1mm steel panel.
 
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Camo5

Cable Smoosher
Sep 5, 2020
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My only genuine concern is for people who are using 3+ of the PCIE lanes on an atx board and looking for a smaller case, such as myself. Using riser cables has always been very off-putting for me
 

duynguyenle

Airflow Optimizer
Aug 20, 2019
246
218
My only genuine concern is for people who are using 3+ of the PCIE lanes on an atx board and looking for a smaller case, such as myself. Using riser cables has always been very off-putting for me
Looks like this is the wrong case for you then. I would suggest looking towards more conventional layout cases if you don't want to use risers. Corsair, CoolerMaster, Fractal Design et al... do offer plenty of options for people who want to use multiple PCIe devices on an ATX boards.

Edit: I forgot about the Cerberus X, that would probably be more in line with what you're looking for
 
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riba2233

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Yeah I mean we have to remember that this is only a 14 L case, and there are some limits. I don't think that is realistic to expect to have support for full size atx with all expansion slots. I think that 5 (of 7) of them is not bad.

Yes, risers are not ideal but they allow for some serious volume and footprint reduction, which is the whole point of SFF for me.

As you can see, smallest cases that have "classic" ATX layout and don't use risers are at least around 23 L and have much wider footprint, so at that point you can just grab something like fractal meshify or define compact, we all have space in height, width is always the most problematic dimension if you want to put your PC on a desk.

So basically it is either using riser OR having small footprint, can't have both.
 
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Camo5

Cable Smoosher
Sep 5, 2020
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Which is a perfectly legitimate compromise, honestly. The main draw for this case is it's very small footprint, so I can keep it under my desk by my feet. Assuming the case material is steel, what are the overall dimensions for the hole cutout area? I'm planning to add some dust filters.
 
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riba2233

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Which is a perfectly legitimate compromise, honestly. The main draw for this case is it's very small footprint, so I can keep it under my desk by my feet. Assuming the case material is steel, what are the overall dimensions for the hole cutout area? I'm planning to add some dust filters.
Yes, it's sides are made out of steel, and I will post exact measurements of ventilated area when I get back home to my PC.
 
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Camo5

Cable Smoosher
Sep 5, 2020
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There is a custom supplier of magnetic filters I found:

once you get the prototype it would be easy to custom order filters to cover all openings :D
 

shinwilliams

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New User
Sep 24, 2020
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Not sure if it's been pointed out yet, but due to the abnormally short PCBs on the new Nvidia FE cards, I think once EK and others start coming out with FE-model waterblocks we'll be able to fit some pretty high-performance GPUs in cases like the P-ATX and N-ATX. For comparison whereas cards like the 2080ti FE had PCBs of the full-length 267 mm, the 3090 FE (apparently) has a PCB of only about 200 mm due to the new cooler design. Given the lack of SFF-friendly GPUs in Ampere (and we'll see if **Big** Navi is any smaller, but I doubt it), watercooling the FE cards may be the way to go assuming you can actually get one.

I think that kind of config would work pretty nicely in the N-ATX given the radiator compatibility and being able to put the GPU in the upper position.

Only issue I see with the 3090 might be that they put a full triple-slot IO bracket on the card outputs, despite having only one row of ports. It looks like the bracket for the 3080 or 3070 could be substituted (the screw holes look like they line up in a side by side picture), but how you'd get your hands on an extra one without purchasing a whole extra GPU would be a challenge, I'd think.
 
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riba2233

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Not sure if it's been pointed out yet, but due to the abnormally short PCBs on the new Nvidia FE cards, I think once EK and others start coming out with FE-model waterblocks we'll be able to fit some pretty high-performance GPUs in cases like the P-ATX and N-ATX. For comparison whereas cards like the 2080ti FE had PCBs of the full-length 267 mm, the 3090 FE (apparently) has a PCB of only about 200 mm due to the new cooler design. Given the lack of SFF-friendly GPUs in Ampere (and we'll see if **Big** Navi is any smaller, but I doubt it), watercooling the FE cards may be the way to go assuming you can actually get one.

I think that kind of config would work pretty nicely in the N-ATX given the radiator compatibility and being able to put the GPU in the upper position.

Only issue I see with the 3090 might be that they put a full triple-slot IO bracket on the card outputs, despite having only one row of ports. It looks like the bracket for the 3080 or 3070 could be substituted (the screw holes look like they line up in a side by side picture), but how you'd get your hands on an extra one without purchasing a whole extra GPU would be a challenge, I'd think.
Hi, I guess you haven't seen the renders on previous page 😁



Regarding brackets, they learned from previous gen and now all the cards I've seen have 2-slot bracket (except for 3090 FE of course but it makes sense for that card). And I hope that single slot brackets will be provided with waterblocks. If not, I may make them.

But thank you anyway, you are thinking in the right direction!
 
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riba2233

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I have a question for all of you - do you like the symmetrical ventilation on both right and left panel? I am thinking on using that kind of design on P-ATX also.
 
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Kit

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Nov 2, 2019
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I like the idea, anything to help with temperature in a SFF PC is a bonus in my book, might be an idea to offer an option if you can like Sliger do on most of their panels?