Stalled NCASE Project Sidearm

[Boil]

@Necere

This would REALLY be a great product...!!!

I know it is similar to the M1, but I would see it more as an M1- WC Edition...

All the points you have made in regards to how it is different from the M1 are exactly what I think would sell this...

The side window that does not make you compromise on the WC setup...

The efficient bottom radiator design...

The laminar air flow design...

Please expound more on FlexATX changes you found at Computex that made you show interest in this product again...?

I would buy one of these in a heartbeat (the FlexATX / reference GPU / water cooled dual 120mm fans & 240mm radiator version)...

As for the "we insist on temp controlled FlexATX", I would think you could get exactly that with a special order from FSP, and I am sure that whatever the MOQ for the FlexATX PSU, there would be more than enough SFF aficionados who would also snap these up (PSU included)...

Now, about that custom wiring harness...

Also, thoughts towards running a 38mm radiator...

Run as is, or add some 10mm (or so) feet...?

And how much space would there be for a reservoir / pump combo (assuming CPU & GPU in loop, meaning the reduction in thickness of the GPU due to the water block would increase the area for a reservoir / pump combo)...?

I would think an EK-XRES 100 Revo D5 combo, with the borosilicate glass tube, would look great in this chassis...!

Also, would there be any bracket that would allow mounting of the reservoir / pump combo included with the WC version...?

I would imagine a bracket / plate that was parallel with the FlexATX PSU; this could have holes for various uses; SSDs, D5 pumps like above, DDC pumps...

I would definitively be a chassis crying out for a nice hard line WC install...!!!

 

[Boil]

A few things that have me thinking...

Tubing runs & cable runs...

How & where to run both without blocking the intake fans too much...?

Seems like majority of MBs have the 24-pin alongside the RAM slots & the 8-pin EPS either along the same strip of MB real estate, or along the top edge of the MB...

24-pin could come around behind the res/pump combo, and the EPS 8-pin could run up the front GPU-side edge of the chassis, along the top GPU-side edge & to the appropriate location on the MB...

GPU itself is easy, as the power connector(s) for the GPU would be adjacent to the PSU itself...

Then there is the Molex connector needed for the res/pump combo, along with the 4-pin PWM connector for same...

And the two 4-pin PWM cables for the intake fans themselves...

Main cables (MB / CPU / GPU) would be three or four cables; either three with a pigtail connector (6+2?) off the GPU 8-pin for three cables, or two 8-pin (second 6+2) cables for a total of four main cables...

Another four slimmer cables for the fans & res/pump combo... Three to the MB & one to a Molex on the PSU...

This, of course, is assuming a M.2 SSD only build..

Now the WC tubing runs may be a bit more interesting...

Res / Pump combo > CPU > GPU > Radiator > back to Res / Pump combo...?

 

[Necere]

Another day, another concept. Riffing on the idea of a more compact case in line with my original conception of the Sidearm - i.e., an A4-SFX/Razer Core-sized case, with a side-by-side layout:

Specs

• Dimensions: 230 x 110 x 300mm, 7.6L
• CPU cooler: 37 or 42mm
• GPU: up to ~275mm, airflow optimized for blower cards
• Drives: 1x 2.5"
• PSU: FlexATX
• Fans: 2x 92mm bottom intake, filtered

Overall, component selection is more limited than e.g. the A4-SFX - the cost of getting forced airflow/dust filtration into roughly the same volume. Also the hoop feet are included in the volume measurement, unlike the A4's feet; without them it would come in under 7L.

CPU cooler is limited to 37mm (the height of the Noctua L9i), but leaves 5mm of clearance for an M1-style single fan bracket over the CPU to attach a fan and/or dust filter to. Reversing the CPU fan to exhaust is a viable alternative in this layout, which obviates the need for the side bracket/filter, and brings the total clearance up to 42mm. I could, I suppose, add ~6mm to the width to get it the same cooler compatibility as the A4 and Sentry (48mm).

Stylistically, it borrows from my old "half-Mac" mATX concept. The hoop feet in my judgment being too problematic strength-wise for a larger, heavier case (given the thinner gauge sheet we need to use), here with the much lower weight I think it could actually work.

Anyway, just thought I'd share. I'm sure you're all getting a bit sick of me pushing out pretty new eye candy concepts that never seem to go anywhere (I know w360 is). That's how I am, though: I work on things when I'm inspired by them, and new ideas are usually more inspiring than plugging away at the messy details of realizing an existing design. Also, indecision. Lots of ideas, lots of pros and cons to everything = lots of difficult decisions. So, they get put off, and I make eye candy instead.

 

[wywywywy]

Gosh I do love seeing Necere and Wahaha360 duking it out

Thanks for not making these "battles" behind closed doors!

 

[Necere]

/can't tell if sarcasm

Just being honest, though. And that's why he's working on his version of the PCX; he needs something to move forward with with manufacturers and suppliers, and he wants it for the Chinese market as well. My careful consideration of every detail, indecision, and snail's pace don't lend themselves to the kind of action he needs to have happening in his life/business.

 

[wywywywy]

Not sarcasm!

When design ideas clash, we as customers/outsiders/enthusiasts get to see a lot of new ideas! I think we do realise you and w360 have different visions, but each new iteration is closer to a final product that is better and better than the very first original idea. Some of it probably wouldn't have happened if there was no difference in opinion I guess?

If you guys were a big company and all these happened behind closed door, we wouldn't have seen any of it and also wouldn't have been so attached to your products.

 

[GentlemanShark]

GPU looks a bit choked behind that PSU, is it getting good enough air flow?

 

[Veryaton]

Another day, another concept. Riffing on the idea of a more compact case in line with my original conception of the Sidearm - i.e., an A4-SFX/Razer Core-sized case, with a side-by-side layout:

It's very nice. But, why not a bit more width, about 3 cm more?, this lets a third graphic card slot, for more clearence for custom graphic card or a second PCIe card using a M.2 to PCIe extender, and also two 120 mm fans at the bottom.
Well, only one idea.

 

[Necere]

GPU looks a bit choked behind that PSU, is it getting good enough air flow?

There's about 18mm between the GPU blower intake and the PSU:

It's very nice. But, why not a bit more width, about 3 cm more?, this lets a third graphic card slot, for more clearence for custom graphic card or a second PCIe card using a M.2 to PCIe extender, and also two 120 mm fans at the bottom.
Well, only one idea.

You can always say "why not x more?" The reasons for or against depend on your goals, and for this specific concept my goal was to get it as small and portable as possible, without giving up forced airflow, positive pressure, and dust control.

 

[Qrash]

Do you foresee the PSU fan facing inwards or outwards?

 

[Necere]

Do you foresee the PSU fan facing inwards or outwards?

Well, it's FlexATX, and as FlexATX does it will have a 40mm fan at one end, and air will travel through the length of the PSU. In this case it's oriented vertically so the airflow will be from bottom (assisted by the 92mm case fan) to top.

 

[Qrash]

Well, it's FlexATX, and as FlexATX does it will have a 40mm fan at one end, and air will travel through the length of the PSU. In this case it's oriented vertically so the airflow will be from bottom (assisted by the 92mm case fan) to top.

Doh! Thanks for straightening me out.

 

[jmsantos1983]

Another day, another concept. Riffing on the idea of a more compact case in line with my original conception of the Sidearm - i.e., an A4-SFX/Razer Core-sized case, with a side-by-side layout:

Specs

• Dimensions: 230 x 110 x 300mm, 7.6L
• CPU cooler: 37 or 42mm
• GPU: up to ~275mm, airflow optimized for blower cards
• Drives: 1x 2.5"
• PSU: FlexATX
• Fans: 2x 92mm bottom intake, filtered

Overall, component selection is more limited than e.g. the A4-SFX - the cost of getting forced airflow/dust filtration into roughly the same volume. Also the hoop feet are included in the volume measurement, unlike the A4's feet; without them it would come in under 7L.

CPU cooler is limited to 37mm (the height of the Noctua L9i), but leaves 5mm of clearance for an M1-style single fan bracket over the CPU to attach a fan and/or dust filter to. Reversing the CPU fan to exhaust is a viable alternative in this layout, which obviates the need for the side bracket/filter, and brings the total clearance up to 42mm. I could, I suppose, add ~6mm to the width to get it the same cooler compatibility as the A4 and Sentry (48mm).

Stylistically, it borrows from my old "half-Mac" mATX concept. The hoop feet in my judgment being too problematic strength-wise for a larger, heavier case (given the thinner gauge sheet we need to use), here with the much lower weight I think it could actually work.

Anyway, just thought I'd share. I'm sure you're all getting a bit sick of me pushing out pretty new eye candy concepts that never seem to go anywhere (I know w360 is). That's how I am, though: I work on things when I'm inspired by them, and new ideas are usually more inspiring than plugging away at the messy details of realizing an existing design. Also, indecision. Lots of ideas, lots of pros and cons to everything = lots of difficult decisions. So, they get put off, and I make eye candy instead.

This case has style. I like to have it.

 

[BaK]

There's about 18mm between the GPU blower intake and the PSU:

Gorgeous renders here also!

I am working on a similar setup, with 2x 120mm fans though, and have opted for a back to back position of the GPU / Motherboard (as of the A4 SFX).
From what I see, the 'A4 positions' would let you have the GPU closer to the motherboard than 18mm. 12mm sounds realistic enough to have the riser sandwiched between cards (even with an M.2 at the back of the mobo), and you wouldn't have to add 6mm to the width in order to fit 48mm CPU coolers.

But I'm sure there is an obvious reason, could you please explain why you've chosen to place the GPU facing the back of the mobo?
Like this aren't you afraid the riser is going to block most of the airflow from the fan at the back?

What about the noise of the PSU 40mm fan?

 

[CC Ricers]

Nice to see the SideArm concept still going. That's gonna look like a great alternative to Dan's A4. And it looks like it's closer to the layout of the original A4 prototype, with the GPU stacked behind the motherboard with a short riser. And as replacement for the Flex ATX PSU someone can use a HD-PLEX 400W in its place with a power brick outside if they want something quieter.

 

[Arboreal]

Nice to see the SideArm concept still going. That's gonna look like a great alternative to Dan's A4. And it looks like it's closer to the layout of the original A4 prototype, with the GPU stacked behind the motherboard with a short riser. And as replacement for the Flex ATX PSU someone can use a HD-PLEX 400W in its place with a power brick outside if they want something quieter.

I was looking at @wywywywy recommending Sidearm as a potential replacement for an SG13 in another thread, and greatly lamenting the demise of the Sidearm development plan.

Well, waddya know? a new render from @Necere, looking as good as ever.

My only comment would be the loss of the handle in any form - that's what really drew me to the original Sidearm design - the hidden handle that was ready to go in the top. Any chance of a stylish and light optional handle for it???

I am hoping to get my poor man's 17L case mod moving forward soon (after a glacial rate of progress), with some SFX PSU mounts and working out how to secure the new alu side panels to the steel frame. I am enthused by seeing good design and engineering at work here.

Luckily, the Ncase M1 for sale on my other regular forum is out of budget, as it would kill my GPU fund that is more pressing.

Edit: BTW, the extra 6mm for cooler height would be appreciated; it would allow the C7 to be used, which I like, for better or worse.

Anyway, great work guys, and keep at it

 

[Necere]

From what I see, the 'A4 positions' would let you have the GPU closer to the motherboard than 18mm. 12mm sounds realistic enough to have the riser sandwiched between cards (even with an M.2 at the back of the mobo), and you wouldn't have to add 6mm to the width in order to fit 48mm CPU coolers.

It's the distance between the GPU and PSU that's 18mm; the distance between the GPU and the motherboard is about half that, and it can't really get any less.

But I'm sure there is an obvious reason, could you please explain why you've chosen to place the GPU facing the back of the mobo?
Like this aren't you afraid the riser is going to block most of the airflow from the fan at the back?

Mainly because it allows a shorter riser to be used, which cost less and are generally more reliable than long risers.

There may be some advantage for dust control as well. If the layout were changed to the A4's back-to-back style, the panel on that side would need to be ventilated for the GPU to draw air through directly. Problem is, GPU fans already have the restriction of the heatsink to push through, so adding filters on top of that is going to hurt performance and/or increase noise. Better to put filters on the bottom fans and let the GPU draw air from inside the case.

In regards to the riser blocking airflow, it's true that it will block some. However my intention is to use a PCIe x8 riser, which can be about half as wide, yet has no significant performance difference compared to x16 for typical GPU use. Using an x8 riser would block perhaps 1/3 of one of the 92mm fans.

What about the noise of the PSU 40mm fan?

With a temperature-controlled fan and suitable fan profile, I would expect it to be pretty reasonable. Remember one of the bottom intake fans will be assisting in pushing air through the PSU, taking some of the burden off its own fan (though this will only help if the PSU fan is temperature- and not load-controlled).

I was looking at @wywywywy recommending Sidearm as a potential replacement for an SG13 in another thread, and greatly lamenting the demise of the Sidearm development plan.

To be clear, though, this most recent concept is different (smaller) than the one in the first post, and won't have any sort of water cooling support. What you see is pretty much what you get on this one.

My only comment would be the loss of the handle in any form - that's what really drew me to the original Sidearm design - the hidden handle that was ready to go in the top. Any chance of a stylish and light optional handle for it???

"Stylish" being the challenge. The readily available ones don't look that impressive. I could probably still integrate the same one I used in the prior concept, though.

BTW, the extra 6mm for cooler height would be appreciated; it would allow the C7 to be used, which I like, for better or worse.

The C7 would suffer the same problem it does in the A4, I would think. Specifically, the proximity of the fan blades to the side panel vents causing turbulence and increased noise.

 

[entropy]

@Necere The aesthetics of the case look very nice, but what if you flipped the PSU by 90 degrees so the case was shorter? The mobo + thickness of the PSU would be 170mm + 40mm or about 210 mm long, which is about the length of the mini 1080Ti, so you could make the case even smaller at the cost of a more limited GPU choice. It would also give you more clearance for the CPU cooler, which can be a problem on the A4. You might be able to reduce it down to 5-6 L with this layout.

 

[Kmpkt]

at the cost of a more limited GPU choice

I think this would be the issue. If you're looking to absolutely make the case as small as possible, then it makes sense to start doing things like flipping the power supply to shorten the case. I believe where the problem with that approach lies is that the majority of people in the broader market buy a case expecting that they can just slam into the case whichever GPU they choose. Considering that this case seems to be destined for production at some point, I reckon that limiting the end user's hardware choices too much is a recipe for disaster.

 

[Necere]

@Necere The aesthetics of the case look very nice, but what if you flipped the PSU by 90 degrees so the case was shorter? The mobo + thickness of the PSU would be 170mm + 40mm or about 210 mm long, which is about the length of the mini 1080Ti, so you could make the case even smaller at the cost of a more limited GPU choice. It would also give you more clearance for the CPU cooler, which can be a problem on the A4. You might be able to reduce it down to 5-6 L with this layout.

That'd change the proportions of the case considerably, going from a long, narrow design to a shorter, boxier look. The latter might be more suitable for a case primarily intended to sit on a desktop and not take up much space, but I think the slimmer shape of the former lends itself more to portability. Also the current "half-Mac" styling wouldn't really work with those proportions. Ultimately it's really a pretty different case that you're proposing, and while there's nothing in particular wrong with it, at the moment I'm a little reluctant to let this design concept go.

In regards to GPU choice, it's true that only supporting short cards would drastically limit the number of GPU options, but I also don't necessarily see that as a deal breaker. We've consistently seen at a least a few models of short card in every generation over the past few years. Certainly not the limiting factor it once might have been. That said, for this particular concept, targeting at least reference size makes sense.