Production FormD T1 Classic (READ FIRST POST)

[scatterforce]

@fabio

Thanks for all the testing! By the looks of things, the HW Labs LS120 30mm performed better. This work is making me doubt my preference of air. I had planned to use the triple slot option and a 50mm air cooler on a 2600x (or equivalent). My aim is to use a Black Ridge Alpenfohen or mod an AXP 100 copper with an under-mounted fan. My hope is that with the CPU fan under the fin stack, I can manage temps with glass panels.

Am I crazy to think that this could work?

 

[fabio]

@scatterforce On air you should keep it power limited at around 120W, and could work!!

But It depends on the task of course. Gaming is not my field, so I don't know. FOr everything else is fine, really, apart from rendering and encoding of course.
BTW https://www.techpowerup.com/251892/intel-readies-energy-efficient-35-watt-core-i9-9900t-processor

 

[marvel.marv]

Just a quick chime in from someone who just did his first simple SFF case in a similar layout, just watching the design and engineering on this case gives me a tingling in my wallet. This looks absolutely stunning. Great job guys!

 

[QuantumBraced]

Speaking of high TDP CPUs, how much larger would the case have to be to support most/all 240mm AIOs, not just the Alphacool one? What's the issue, the power connector?

 

[Wahaha360]

Speaking of high TDP CPUs, how much larger would the case have to be to support most/all 240mm AIOs, not just the Alphacool one? What's the issue, the power connector?

About 1-1.5L, assuming 240 AIO 30mm thick with 25mm fans. If that's what you must have, the C4 will be cheaper alternative.

The issue is the case must be taller to accommodate most AIOs, this breaks the current proportions (near golden ratio), imo, a taller case make it look like a skinny M1, which I'm not a big fan of.

 

[Alur]

About 1-1.5L, assuming 240 AIO 30mm thick with 25mm fans. If that's what you must have, the C4 will be cheaper alternative.

The issue is the case must be taller to accommodate most AIOs, this breaks the current proportions (near golden ratio), imo, a taller case make it look like a skinny M1, which I'm not a big fan of.

Exxcuse me Waha, it may be already answered, but can you install on top 2 fans? I am running around the pages but it is a bit confusing, clearly not on the PSU side as far as I can see, thanks!

 

[teodoro]

Is the 2slot gpu configuration a strict 42mm or might there be a touch of wiggle room for those 2.1 cards (possibly depending on the side panel type)?

 

[QuantumBraced]

About 1-1.5L, assuming 240 AIO 30mm thick with 25mm fans. If that's what you must have, the C4 will be cheaper alternative.

The issue is the case must be taller to accommodate most AIOs, this breaks the current proportions (near golden ratio), imo, a taller case make it look like a skinny M1, which I'm not a big fan of.

I see. What about a 30mm radiator + 15mm fans? If it's just a height issue, I think it would be worth making the case 5mm taller to support mainstream 240mm AIOs + 15mm fans. The Alphacool LT240 is fine, but it's a little ugly and it'd be nice to have more options. I think it would be worth it to make the case truly OC-friendly.

 

[fabio]

Another small test, this time OPEN "CUSTOM" BENCH with:

ASRock Z390 Phantom Gaming ITX
9900K All Core 5GHz, AVX offset 3, 1.250V Core VCCIO 1.05V, VCCSA 1.15V
G.Skill 2x16GB 3200Mhz C14 OC 3600MHZ C16 16 36 1.36V
Samsung 970 Pro + EKWB M.2 Heatsink
Asetek 545LC + Noctua A9 PMW
Ambient 22.5 degrees

Here the results with 25 minutes of Blender:

 

[fabio]

Sorry, can someone explain to me one thing?

I've run the 8700K and the 9900K on the same board. The 8700K OC all core at 4.8GHz, AVX 1, and the 9900K 5Ghz all core with AVX 3.

Same RAM at 3600MHz C16 16 36

In Intel Burn Test, the 8700K was FASTER??? Every test was done at Very High in 43 seconds with the 8700K, and 54 seconds with the 9900K?

Am I missing something?

 

[Wahaha360]

Exxcuse me Waha, it may be already answered, but can you install on top 2 fans? I am running around the pages but it is a bit confusing, clearly not on the PSU side as far as I can see, thanks!

I see. What about a 30mm radiator + 15mm fans? If it's just a height issue, I think it would be worth making the case 5mm taller to support mainstream 240mm AIOs + 15mm fans. The Alphacool LT240 is fine, but it's a little ugly and it'd be nice to have more options. I think it would be worth it to make the case truly OC-friendly.

15mm fans don’t have enough static pressure on 30mm thick radiator to be effective in this layout, maybe on open bench.

The Sandwich / A4 layout is very dense and difficult for airflow compare to traditional layout. This is why JayzTwoCents using 240x30mm radiator on 25mm thick fans via Louqe Ghost got subpar results. The air has a hard time moving in such dense layouts.

In pull configuration, with radiator on the bottom, a 15mm thick fan has to pull through dust filter + radiator and then push air through the dense components and cables, this is not promising b/c 15mm fans are inferior for static pressure compare to 25mm thick fans. How much difference requires testing in the case, not open bench.

In push configuration, flipping the case, radiator on top, fans inexhaust mode, I think 240x30mm radiator will do better, the question is, will it be better enough to justify the size increase.

I will do some test and quantify the difference when I get prototype 2, I know 240 by 30mm thick radiator subject will keep coming up.

 

[QuantumBraced]

15mm fans don’t have enough static pressure on 30mm thick radiator to be effective in this layout, maybe on open bench.

The Sandwich / A4 layout is very dense and difficult for airflow compare to traditional layout. This is why JayzTwoCents using 240x30mm radiator on 25mm thick fans via Louqe Ghost got subpar results. The air has a hard time moving in such dense layouts.

In pull configuration, with radiator on the bottom, a 15mm thick fan has to pull through dust filter + radiator and then push air through the dense components and cables, this is not promising b/c 15mm fans are inferior for static pressure compare to 25mm thick fans. How much difference requires testing in the case, not open bench.

In push configuration, flipping the case, radiator on top, fans inexhaust mode, I think 240x30mm radiator will do better, the question is, will it be better enough to justify the size increase.

I will do some test and quantify the difference when I get prototype 2, I know 240 by 30mm thick radiator subject will keep coming up.

That makes sense. I look forward to testing results. Do you think a 240x30mm rad + 15mm fans would perform worse than a 120x30 rad + 25mm fan?

This is why I thought making the feet 5mm taller would be worth it, but I guess it would compromise aesthetics some. And it's really because of the filters, if you use Demciflex or Silverstone they are kind of saggy, with 5mm feet they may even touch the floor under the case, significantly obstructing airflow. So I'd probably put them in between the rad and the case floor and just vacuum the dust, but that's not ideal.

 

[Wahaha360]

Exxcuse me Waha, it may be already answered, but can you install on top 2 fans? I am running around the pages but it is a bit confusing, clearly not on the PSU side as far as I can see, thanks!

If you are asking about 4 fans running, two on the bottom, two on the top, then no, and it's unnecessary.

Flipping the case, where the two 120x25mm fans are at the top and in exhaust mode works even better.

The SFX bracket is designed that it can flip the PSU orientation as well, so the SFX can exhaust through the top of the case.

 

[Wahaha360]

Is the 2slot gpu configuration a strict 42mm or might there be a touch of wiggle room for those 2.1 cards (possibly depending on the side panel type)?

There is 129mm wide space for GPU and cooler.

The divider in the middle is designed to move left to right, so there is some wiggle room by design to take advantage of different GPU and CPU cooler combo.

 

[VegetableStu]

AAAAAAAAAA SO CUTE

 

[dondan]

Sorry, can someone explain to me one thing?

I've run the 8700K and the 9900K on the same board. The 8700K OC all core at 4.8GHz, AVX 1, and the 9900K 5Ghz all core with AVX 3.

Same RAM at 3600MHz C16 16 36

In Intel Burn Test, the 8700K was FASTER??? Every test was done at Very High in 43 seconds with the 8700K, and 54 seconds with the 9900K?

Am I missing something?

Did you monitored clocks with CoreTemp?

 

[Seki]

@Wahaha360 Just curious... but will there be an option for non glass side panels?... (EDIT: Just saw the non glass side panels, very nice!)

Also another question... Will there be on option for the front panel to just be a single piece?

I do not want to sound like an idiot, but the thing for me about the Ghost s1 and why i will not buy it, is because with Radiator support, you need that Large top hat, the problem is, the top hat leaves a line around it, which for me just completely ruins it.

I mean, yours is a "better" designed line... but still the same... (I do fully understand why you would want to keep it... I was just curious if there would be an option for a single piece)

Also, Will a full space gray color be available? (I see in pictures something very close to this, hence the question) ... I just want to build a Mac Pro in a tiny shell, for less than a Mac Pro. (using probably a 7980XE and 64GB of RAM)

Other than that, this is a brilliant looking case, And i would be willing to pay the extra for the options.

EDIT2: I wonder if its possible to do the smaller cut piece in black (with the top) and space grey where the silver is... This would be okayish i guess? But still would prefer a single piece front and the whole case space grey.

 

[fabio]

Did you monitored clocks with CoreTemp?

I did through HWinfo.

The 8700K goes between 4.7 to 4.8Ghz for the entire's test duration

The 9900K goes between 4.7 to 5.0Ghz always for the entire test.

The 9900K sample has consistent results compared to my other 9900K.

I was surprised by the 8700K! Or maybe is just the test to be better optimized? But the architecture is the same, so I don't understand.

The only difference is that the 8700K is delidded, but the temps for both were under 75 degrees, so ok!

 

[arjan2856]

Really like this case compared to the other current options. I have a question about the divider, is the bottom corner supported somehow? It looks that with a heavy GPU and CPU cooler there could be quite some flex at this point and leading to vibration of the GPU/Motherboard during traveling with the case which would be my purpose. Is it possible to add a support to the side rail of the case to avoid the flex?

 

[fabio]

@dondan I redid the test on the ASRock Z390.

Intel 9900K OC 5.0, AVX offset 3 (4.7), Cache 4.3, AUTO Voltace, VCCIO 1.05V, VCCSA 1.15V, RAM OC 3600 C16 16 36 1.36V, LLC3

Intel 8700K OC at 4.8, AVX offset 1 (4.7). Cache 4.3, AUTO Voltage , VCCIO 1.05V, VCCSA 1.15V, RAM OC 3466 C16 16 36 1.36V, LLC3
(The CPU is delidded since 1 year)

Well, it's the same, in Intel BurnTest, the 8700K crush the 9900K, with also lower RAM frequency.

(BTW, the ASRock has the best VRMs, but for memory overclock sucks. I don't know if related with the BIOS or circuitry, but the ASUS and the Gigabyte are way better for memory support/OC)

I don't know what is related to.

With both of 9900K, in two different systems, the speed grew with higher RAM Frequency, but the results are always similar between the two 9900K, even with different motherboards.

Here BIOS pictures and the results with Intel BurnTest and Cinebench R15



Intel 9900K




Intel 8700K