yeah that's why I'm in this thread, I'm looking for something bigger than my a4 or my sentry. for 2 slot card I already have those. Well, I don't care whatever dan decide to do. I'm going to buy it anyway. lol
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DAN C4-SFX - old
- Thread starter dondan
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Whether or not the ratio has merit is kind of the pivotal point of the discussion, no? What's the point of adhering to or trying to get close to the ratio if it doesn't look good to begin with?
It is interesting for me to see that always the same forum members (handful) augmenting against the flexible design. They criticize the increased width of 10-19mm. They are augmenting that everyone should by a 2 slot card because with SFF you have to compromise. On the other side they can't make a compromise even with an increased width of only 10mm. They don't see the advantage that this will result in a case with so much more possibilities. A future proofed case that will be also useable if the industry move forward to even more power hungry hardware. A case that will support two different hardware layouts. A case that could be interesting for more customers even those who are skeptical with SFF. A case that will have more space for cable routing and hiding them. They don't see that the sandwich layout is not as space efficient as the classic one if it comes to water cooling. They don't see that this case is still very small.
As I can see on the threads statistic that there are many silint readers here in the thread. I have the hope they will join the discussion.
As I can see on the threads statistic that there are many silint readers here in the thread. I have the hope they will join the discussion.
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yeah, if sff means compromising then everyone will use APU or some kind of onboard gpu.
In the nicest possible way, I'm suffering from 'Design Revision Fatigue'...
Without seeing some of those really good renders and a prototype eventually, I can't really get a grip on what it's going to look and feel like.
I therefore will reserve judgement until Dan has put something more tangible out.
Personally, I see no point in commenting on something that doesn't exist yet.
This has been an extended and painful process that (sadly) has become somewhat tribal and lacking in community spirit at times.
@dondan - keep up the good work, I think the flexible concept is really interesting and could be a real move forward for SFF case design.
As you said yourself, some future proofing won't go amiss.
I look forward to seeing something more tangible soon.
Without seeing some of those really good renders and a prototype eventually, I can't really get a grip on what it's going to look and feel like.
I therefore will reserve judgement until Dan has put something more tangible out.
Personally, I see no point in commenting on something that doesn't exist yet.
This has been an extended and painful process that (sadly) has become somewhat tribal and lacking in community spirit at times.
@dondan - keep up the good work, I think the flexible concept is really interesting and could be a real move forward for SFF case design.
As you said yourself, some future proofing won't go amiss.
I look forward to seeing something more tangible soon.
@dondan - I'm one of those silent readers 
As @Arboreal said, I'm waiting for the flexible concept renderings. It's hard to make an idea without even if I think there's a really nice concept being developped here
Also, I don't want to get in the fights that have been going on - so hey ! I had nothing interesting to say I guess many lurkers are in the same position.
Anyway, please keep the good work on.
As @Arboreal said, I'm waiting for the flexible concept renderings. It's hard to make an idea without even if I think there's a really nice concept being developped here Also, I don't want to get in the fights that have been going on - so hey ! I had nothing interesting to say
I guess many lurkers are in the same position.Anyway, please keep the good work on.
Hi, another silent reader. I'm leaning towards the flex design, but it would be great to have renderings or even a prototype side by side comparison. Looking forward to a replacement for my A4
Well, I think it looks good. The golden ratio is more or less like the rule of thirds - something that works in a lot of places for a lot of people and hence it's merit. But I won't judge anyone for disagreeing because athletical taste is very personal. Just like I won't judge someone's favourite colour
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I've been following Dan's products across several forums for a while and I'm completely on board with what Dan says above. Compromise is an accepted part of SFF builds, but for maximum compromise and minimal size the Dan A4 already exists. The original C4 idea might have looked sleeker/better (the latter is purely subjective of course) than what's being considered now, but it had a lot of the same limitations as the A4 (to the point it wasn't interesting to me at all). I can understand that must be disappointing to someone who really digs the original design, but as a niche in a niche product, that's a bad deal - and if Dan can expand the compatibility (and by proxy, the possible audience) so much by the suggested minor size increase, it would be madness to ignore this just on principle because "SFF is about compromise" or the hyperbolic "just buy an Ncase M1 instead".
Also, straight by numbers the amount of 2- or even 2.5-slot cards sounds like a lot, but if you check out the actual products, most of the well designed SKUs, even for mainstream cards, have gotten larger because it makes the cards cooler, quieter and faster. At the same time, many of the smaller designs are cheaply made and hot/loud. For a case that's not soundproofed while probably sitting next to you on your desk, that's pretty bad, even if we accept that you can only really have two out of "small, powerful, quiet". Getting massive improvements in terms of "powerful" and/or "quiet" for a minor hit to "small" is entirely worth it, to me. Because - again - the A4 already exists if I wanted to go smaller.
Also, straight by numbers the amount of 2- or even 2.5-slot cards sounds like a lot, but if you check out the actual products, most of the well designed SKUs, even for mainstream cards, have gotten larger because it makes the cards cooler, quieter and faster. At the same time, many of the smaller designs are cheaply made and hot/loud. For a case that's not soundproofed while probably sitting next to you on your desk, that's pretty bad, even if we accept that you can only really have two out of "small, powerful, quiet". Getting massive improvements in terms of "powerful" and/or "quiet" for a minor hit to "small" is entirely worth it, to me. Because - again - the A4 already exists if I wanted to go smaller.
@dondan - Just giving my 2 cents, I do prefer the flex layout. But people in this thread have become pretty aggressive about their opinions so im just waiting for another survey.
I think everything objective about each layout has been thoroughly discussed.
And it's obvious that no one will change their mind. So why not just wait for the CAD/render and then cast your vote, rather than having pointless arguments? It gives everyone a bad mood because the harder you try to convince the more people resist.
And it's obvious that no one will change their mind. So why not just wait for the CAD/render and then cast your vote, rather than having pointless arguments? It gives everyone a bad mood because the harder you try to convince the more people resist.
1 Liter might not be much if the case sits on your desk, but it surely is much if you need to be able to transport your case in a Backpack
Chiming in to say I’m more in favor of expanding the case to have more options.
Couple things that bother me about the specific argumentation I’ve read on here:
1) We are talking about size increases that are pretty much immeasurable, it seems like those arguing against them aren’t measuring it up against “what will this look and feel like in real life” but up against a number they have in their head
2) almost always on this forum, which I lurk all over, people who have this very minute issues with the cases are always the ones to chime in. The vast majority of well adjusted people don’t chime in. A lot of the time they have extremely niche issues. I don’t understand why, if they want something so specific and spend so much time bickering, they don’t just make their own case or something.
I think some of the designers on here get very caught up in the feedback loop of the forum when really you should be trying to execute your own vision. Of course it can be useful to take polls and feedback etc but having this sort of democratically designed case will never fit everyone’s wants and needs. At some point you have to make your own decisions about the sort of case that you want to make.
If you want my very niche concerns, which I’ve refrained from posting, it’s about the look of the case, first and foremost. I like the M1 layout and the cooling performance but the M1 is ugly to me. I love the design of the Dan A4, it was the case that got me interested in SFF. The renders on page 1 are worse looking than the M1 to me. I dislike the branding, the sharp edges the stubs sticking out, etc. I understand the details of how the case looks are under constant revision but I’m just saying that’s what interests me in Dancases. I hope this case has a similar design language as the A4, with rounded edges, brushed aluminum, etc
Couple things that bother me about the specific argumentation I’ve read on here:
1) We are talking about size increases that are pretty much immeasurable, it seems like those arguing against them aren’t measuring it up against “what will this look and feel like in real life” but up against a number they have in their head
2) almost always on this forum, which I lurk all over, people who have this very minute issues with the cases are always the ones to chime in. The vast majority of well adjusted people don’t chime in. A lot of the time they have extremely niche issues. I don’t understand why, if they want something so specific and spend so much time bickering, they don’t just make their own case or something.
I think some of the designers on here get very caught up in the feedback loop of the forum when really you should be trying to execute your own vision. Of course it can be useful to take polls and feedback etc but having this sort of democratically designed case will never fit everyone’s wants and needs. At some point you have to make your own decisions about the sort of case that you want to make.
If you want my very niche concerns, which I’ve refrained from posting, it’s about the look of the case, first and foremost. I like the M1 layout and the cooling performance but the M1 is ugly to me. I love the design of the Dan A4, it was the case that got me interested in SFF. The renders on page 1 are worse looking than the M1 to me. I dislike the branding, the sharp edges the stubs sticking out, etc. I understand the details of how the case looks are under constant revision but I’m just saying that’s what interests me in Dancases. I hope this case has a similar design language as the A4, with rounded edges, brushed aluminum, etc
It's not really interesting because they have directly told you why they're arguing against it: They're sick of the constant revisions every time you seem have to cemented on a design. It's tiring, it builds up false hopes, and then they just don't care anymore. There are zero guarantees that you won't change it up again after this either. Naturally, the most excitement that will come from design overhauls will be from newer, fresher people.
I've said it before but you have a knack of getting yourself into the classical iterate-forever mindset instead of just sticking with something and doing it. As for the rest of what you said - no. We are quite clearly capable of seeing advantages that the case has, but we also don't want them due to everything already discussed. Is it really that hard to realise? Instead, you call us blind and insinuate that our criticisms are invalid? Kind of insulting, to be honest.
Better idea: 'I've taken your feedback into consideration however I'm going to pursue the flex design regardless' instead of that entire post. It is quite clear that you very much dislike those of us who have stuck around for a while and aren't on board with your new idea that you quite clearly want to go ahead with. No point arguing there anymore, nor is there any point of further discussion when you'll just reduce it down to 'just noise from a minority' anyway and put down the arguments and those who dislike it.
Good luck with the case, Dan. I think the time for discussion is over. Just make the renders, see if its even possible, then a survey and call it done.
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For all the people complaining, would you rather DAN not collaborate with the community since he likes to explore all the options and make revisions before spending lots of money and time on developing a product?
I for one commend DAN on allowing us to have a voice with all these new ideas and giving our feedback.
If you cannot handle the changes and new ideas that DAN comes up with; I am not sure why you are in this thread.
I for one commend DAN on allowing us to have a voice with all these new ideas and giving our feedback.
If you cannot handle the changes and new ideas that DAN comes up with; I am not sure why you are in this thread.
@dondan ive been following this case for a long time, it should be understandably frustrating when you basically scrap the design every few months or so. The reason I am vocal about my concerns is because I was so enthralled by the original design. of course sff is about *reasonable* compromise - but compromise should be something like not supporting 3.5" drives because there is a more space efficient equivalent. It should always be in the direction of making the case smaller rather than larger. Oh well, I've made my opinion on this and the flex very clear at this point I'm burnt out. I'll check in on the thread if there is a survey or more renderings. Best of luck to you.
I'm very interested to see where this case goes.
I'm currently using a S4 case by NFC and despite the compromises I had to make with regards to component selection, the heat is always on the high-side, so while I am interested in updating my build with another SFF, I am somewhat hesitant due to the heat issues I've encountered
Which brings me to the C4 case, the ability to use an AIO cooler makes it very appealing for me as it would solve my heat issues while still using a SFF build and to top if off, the ability to use a full-length GPU.
One criticism I have with regards to the case is the aesthetics from the positions of the components, as of now, it feels rather "off-centered" so what I thought might be a good solution is to
1. perforate across the area where the GPU sits, instead of perforating it across the center, the reason I say this is because modern GPUs tends to have RGB lighting and if the perforations are centered, it will cause the RGB lighting to be "off centered"which makes it less aesthetically pleasing in my opinion.
2. for the clear acrylic sidepanels, I wonder if it can be done as a "hybrid" meaning to say that the top portion (where the GPU sits) being acrylic and the lower portion is metal and opaque, this might make the overall case look more aesthetically pleasing in my opinion.
Either ways, I'm looking forward to seeing this case be released.
I'm currently using a S4 case by NFC and despite the compromises I had to make with regards to component selection, the heat is always on the high-side, so while I am interested in updating my build with another SFF, I am somewhat hesitant due to the heat issues I've encountered
Which brings me to the C4 case, the ability to use an AIO cooler makes it very appealing for me as it would solve my heat issues while still using a SFF build and to top if off, the ability to use a full-length GPU.
One criticism I have with regards to the case is the aesthetics from the positions of the components, as of now, it feels rather "off-centered" so what I thought might be a good solution is to
1. perforate across the area where the GPU sits, instead of perforating it across the center, the reason I say this is because modern GPUs tends to have RGB lighting and if the perforations are centered, it will cause the RGB lighting to be "off centered"which makes it less aesthetically pleasing in my opinion.
2. for the clear acrylic sidepanels, I wonder if it can be done as a "hybrid" meaning to say that the top portion (where the GPU sits) being acrylic and the lower portion is metal and opaque, this might make the overall case look more aesthetically pleasing in my opinion.
Either ways, I'm looking forward to seeing this case be released.
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