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Power Supply 500W FlexATX PSU

EdZ

Virtual Realist
May 11, 2015
1,578
2,107
If going for a fan replacement, it makes more sense to not even bother with another 40mm and duct in something larger, placed dependant on case geometry (potentially a partial duct leeching flow from a general ventilation fan). That depends on whether the controller is just looking for a non-zero tach signal, or whether it's doing active closed-loop control with a target RPM (which would need a basic uC to spoof the correct tach PWM for a given flow rate).
 

jeshikat

Jessica. Wayward SFF.n Founder
Silver Supporter
Feb 22, 2015
4,969
4,784
I briefly considered making a custom top cover to fit a 80x25mm fan as a psuedo-TFX but I don't think I'll bother.

This just has to hold me over until the HDPLEX 300W AC-DC is out and the idle noise is good enough.
 

iFreilicht

FlexATX Authority
Original poster
Feb 28, 2015
3,243
2,361
freilite.com
Update! Lookout on price and shipping times.

Finally got an offer from FSP today, and we're getting close. This was not the final revision of the unit, but I don't think any of the changes we still have to make would add to the final price.

TL;DR: Maximum price should be $130 USD before tax and shipping, maximum time from end of crowdfunding campaign to the last person receiving their unit should be 25 weeks.

First, the good news. FSP did confirm that they will modify the controllers firmware to prevent the Full-RPM self-test on start up, so it will stay quiet at all times. Additionally, the PSU will be black and that will not increase price nor MOQ, so we're still at 300.

Now for the bad news. This PSU will not be below $100 USD, which was an important price break for many people in the poll. The offer I got is 87.40€ per unit, which is about $93.13 USD. Additionally, the -12V supply which is included with every unit, which will cost me about 5.12€, or $5.47 USD. Now this is still below the magical 100 buck limit, but I can't sell it for that. I need a little bit of a margin, and crowdfunding platforms take their cut as well. I realise that I can't take the usual 1/2 to 1/3 you have with electronics in this instance, but something between 10%-25% is required, so you should expect the final price to be less than $130 USD.

Also remember that this is all before tax and shipping and that the cables on the PSU are very short and I don't plan to include any extension cables because everyone's needs will be different. I did a little bit of research what options there are for extension cables, you can find a spreadsheet here. It's open for anyone to edit so you can add interesting stuff in there if you want.

Hopefully enough people will be interested to still get one to reach the MOQ. I'd really like to give this some exposure so more people know about it, but I don't have review units to give out and putting up ads would cost money which I would have to recoup by increasing the price of the PSU. In theory, to lower MOQ, I could raise the units price and then use the additional funds from that to stock some. In theory, with a 50% margin, I could lower the MOQ to 200. Not sure how people would feel about that, though. Maybe something like Massdrops price-drop model could be used, where the price will be lowered once a certain number of people pre-order the PSU, but I don't think any crowdfunding platform supports that, so I'd either have to turn to Massdrop themselves or implement something like this on my website. Not sure, maybe someone of you have other ideas or feedback on this?

A word about shipping times: On FSPs part, production will take 10-14 weeks, shipping to me will then take another 5. I don't know how long it takes for kickstarter or indiegogo to release funds to the one who's running the campaign, but only after I payed at least half of the total cost will FSP start production, which is over 15.000€. Let's say it takes them 2 weeks, just to be on the safe side. Then after that, I can start shipping, and at 300 units it will probably take me quite some time, maybe 1-2 weeks if I'm working on that full-time. To make it a little fairer, I can ship the units going outside the EU first because those will take longer, but in total it could still take 4 weeks until they reach everybody.
The worst case grand total then would be 25 weeks or close to 6 months from the end of the campaign to the last person receiving their unit. So to make it until Christmas with possible delays or problems, the campaign should start in the middle of May. I'll probably run it for 2 to 3 weeks, anything above that makes little sense.

Finally, I also asked them about the FSP500-50FGGBN, a Gold FlexATX unit that will integrate the -12V rail. First samples are allegedly to be finished in June. I'm still awaiting feedback around that, but because of the lower efficiency, I am less confident about the noise profile on this unit. The FSP500-50FSPT to this day is the highest quality and most power dense FlexATX PSU, and I think that you shouldn't make any compromise with such a vital component. However, price is an important factor for many, so it could well be a "budget" alternative for those who find the Platinum version too expensive.

Thanks for reading! Sorry about the wall of text.
 

Ceros_X

King of Cable Management
Mar 8, 2016
748
660
The best way to get 300 is to have all the indie case makers who are designing cases around a FlexATX PSU post a link to the kick starter in their thread stating this will be the optimal PSU to use, already painted black, etc. If you start the coordination right now that will definitely help you get most of the way there.
 
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iFreilicht

FlexATX Authority
Original poster
Feb 28, 2015
3,243
2,361
freilite.com
The previous plan was to collaborate with Hahutzy and sync up our campaigns because his case had the most exposure of all FlexATX cases, but there doesn't seem to've been any progress on that for some time. I'll look for ways to get the MOQ down. In the end, 300 units will sell, especially when my version of the PSU costs as much as the one they have on amazon right now, just not in the few weeks that a campaign will be running.
 
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jeshikat

Jessica. Wayward SFF.n Founder
Silver Supporter
Feb 22, 2015
4,969
4,784
They seem to have disappeared off Amazon, anyone know what happened?
 

msystems

King of Cable Management
Apr 28, 2017
804
1,405
I hope they make this... I would be buying it today. Might pull the trigger on the Athena one just for the hell of it while I wait
 

msystems

King of Cable Management
Apr 28, 2017
804
1,405
This has the potential to inspire some super thin cases. I believe it's a 40.5mm height profile on the flex atx PSU, so a design around that spec could allow a minimum of a 45mm thick case (but with basically no clearances) that could still fit a dual slot PCI-e x 16 on a riser, and can fit a NH L9i heatsink (without fan), or a heatpipe assembly.

Cooling would need some planning. Holes/cutouts below the PCI-e area for sure to match the fan arrangement, and vent holes over the entire chassis for convection. I'm not sure a fan could fit anywhere so a <35w processor would be desired. Potential 310xmm x 280mm x 45mm footprint.

Something like this:



That is a 47mm case. It's the thinnest case I could find.





Unfortunately it appears to be discontinued.
We still have the FC5. 59mm without risers / 55m internal.

 
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Necere

Shrink Ray Wielder
NCASE
Feb 22, 2015
1,720
3,284
The stock fan is 15mm thick.
We had a conference call with FSP a bit ago and supporting 20mm thick fans on future products was something I suggested to them during the call. This was before the the Noctua was announced, but combing through fan catalogs I noticed there seemed to be a better selection of 20mm thick fans. As is, at least with the 400W flex unit I looked at, there's zero space internally for an extra 5mm on the fan. The PCB and components fill pretty much every available millimeter of space.
 
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Overtek

Airflow Optimizer
OVERTEK
Gold Supporter
May 22, 2017
325
529
www.overtek.co.uk
We had a conference call with FSP a bit ago and supporting 20mm thick fans on future products was something I suggested to them during the call. This was before the the Noctua was announced, but combing through fan catalogs I noticed there seemed to be a better selection of 20mm thick fans. As is, at least with the 400W flex unit I looked at, there's zero space internally for an extra 5mm on the fan. The PCB and components fill pretty much every available millimeter of space.
The option there for FSP then would be to use a slightly deeper PSU case. But unless they use an exisiting one its a whole load of extra cost. But its simple numbers with FSP. If you can give them a big quantity then you can get what you want. With some other manufacturers you might find the MOQ is a little lower, depending how desperate for business they are, and perhaps your unit price point a little higher.
 

EdZ

Virtual Realist
May 11, 2015
1,578
2,107
Buried in a story about a WC PSU from FSP is an interesting tidbit:
In an email to HEXUS, FSP outlined another couple of interesting products it would showcase at Computex alongside the Hydro PTM+. Most interestingly FSP is readying "the world smallest 80 Plus Platinum certified 850W FLEX PSU."
While it would probably be too much to hope for a 150mm 850W PSU, even a 190mm 800W FlexATX would be an interesting beast. Let's see what turns up at Computex!
 
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