DAN A4-SFX v4.1

[archagon]

I've got some potentially bad news. Stress testing a 3080 FE with my SilverStone SX700-PT PSU flipped. After 5-10 minutes of FurMark, my computer inevitably powers off, tries to turn on a few times, and then eventually boots. My working theory is that the PSU has some sort of fuse when the temps get too high. (This is in line with this model, as well as most others I've looked at, having a max operating temp of 40C.) Anyone else with an FE able to replicate?

Voltage seems fine and CPU/GPU temps are entirely reasonable, so I don't know what else it could be. Currently trying the last thing I can think of, which is connecting my GPU to two separate PCIE cables from the PSU instead of just one that splits. (Not sure how this could be it, though, given that the card runs fine at 320W for several minutes before the computer powers down, and that no voltage drop is observed in MSI's monitoring widget.)

EDIT: Although, so far so good 10-15 minutes in, so maybe it was the split cable after all...

EDIT2: Nope, still powered off, but took about 20-25 minutes this time. (3DMark’s Time Spy Extreme stress test will hit this more reliably.) Will try a different wall outlet first, and will try re-flipping the PSU after that.

EDIT3: Switched to wall outlet. Time Spy Extreme stress test failed after about 7 minutes. As an aside, the behavior of the computer is a bit erratic for a few minutes after the initial shut down. The PC will try to start again several times and fail immediately. When it boots, it will likely fail again a few minutes in. After that, it's usually OK.

 

[Bonusround]

Nice. Now please do a 3080 in the same form factor.

There is, its called "Founders Edition"

Haha, right. Show me where to find one of those.

Unlike Nvidia, Gigabyte might actually want to sell me one of their cards.

 

[dondan]

I've got some potentially bad news. Stress testing a 3080 FE with my SilverStone SX700-PT PSU flipped. After 5-10 minutes of FurMark, my computer inevitably powers off, tries to turn on a few times, and then eventually boots. My working assumption is that the PSU has some sort of fuse when the temps get too high. (This is in line with this model, as well as most others I've looked at, having a max operating temp of 40C.) Anyone else with an FE able to replicate?

Voltage seems fine and CPU/GPU temps are entirely reasonable, so I don't know what else it could be. Currently trying the last thing I can think of, which is connecting my GPU to two separate PCIE cables from the PSU instead of just one that splits. (Not sure how this could be it, though, given that the card runs fine at 320W for several minutes before the computer powers down, and that no voltage drop is observed in MSI's monitoring widget.)

EDIT: Although, so far so good 10-15 minutes in, so maybe it was the split cable after all...
EDIT2: Nope, still powered off, but took about 20-25 minutes this time. Will try a different wall outlet first, and will try re-flipping the PSU after that.

Please keep us up to date. Can you make a picture? Did you install the latest Nvidia driver for the GPU high clock crash problem?
Maybe the operating temp of 40°C of the Silverstone is a problem. This is why I ordered a Fractal Design 650W that has a 50°C operating temp.
Another solution could be adding a slim 92mm fan above the PSU inside the case that pull more air outside the PSU.

 

[archagon]

Drivers are 456.71, so high clock crash should be fixed. What do you want a picture of?

If the stress test succeeds with the PSU intake fan facing outwards, I might just decide to keep it that way unless the temps are terrible -- maybe with the GPU undervolted a bit. After that, perhaps I'll trade the FE for a 3080 blower or Big Navi equivalent when those come out.

(Case is great, by the way!)

 

[dondan]

A picture of the case with all outer panels off from the top.

 

[archagon]

With the PSU outside the case, Time Spy Extreme stress test continued for 20m without any reboots, so it's almost certainly a PSU temperature issue. Too bad.

Here's what the case looked like before I pulled the PSU out:

 

[Bonusround]

What happens when you test with the PSU entirely out of the case, open-bench style?

 

[archagon]

PSU entirely out of the case was totally fine. Same with a subsequent test with the exhaust facing out.

With the PSU exhaust facing out, a 20m session of Time Spy Extreme resulted in a GPU temp of ~84C and a clock of 1710MHz. Quite noisy, though. I think PSU exhaust facing inwards resulted in a ~5-10C improvement, so it's disappointing that this configuration is apparently not possible with the PSU I have.

 

[archagon]

The Fractal PSU @dondan mentioned has the following spec: "Maximum 80% load at 50°C"

I don't know much about electrical engineering. Does this mean that as the PSU temperature increases, the max wattage decreases? If so, I wonder if this issue could be resolved with a higher-watt PSU, e.g. SilverStone's new 800W SFX-L model.

 

[echodriver]

The Fractal PSU @dondan mentioned has the following spec: "Maximum 80% load at 50°C"

I don't know much about electrical engineering. Does this mean that as the PSU temperature increases, the max wattage decreases? If so, I wonder if this issue could be resolved with a higher-watt PSU, e.g. SilverStone's new 800W SFX-L model.

So the more efficient a PSU is, the less watts are lost to heat and so on. PSUs also have over tempersture protection.

When it is too hot, it shuts down. That could be heat generated by itself or from other components.

A PSU that is more efficient AND can operate at higher temperatures will not shut down as early

 

[dondan]

@archagon: Do you have a Noctua A9x14 fan that you can on top of the PSU in pull out mode?

 

[Bonusround]

Discusses performance of a flipped PSU re: the 3090. Different case, potentially relevant learnings:

 

[SiKiaTriK]

There is hope for a 3090 that fit pretty much anywhere... Gigabyte RTX3090 TURBO 24G

More like Turboreactor edition ?

 

[archagon]

@archagon: Do you have a Noctua A9x14 fan that you can on top of the PSU in pull out mode?

How would I mount a fan on top of the case?

 

[archagon]

Discusses performance of a flipped PSU re: the 3090. Different case, potentially relevant learnings:

The Reddit thread has a few people with the same problem as me.

Sounds like maybe the Corsair won't shut down, but I'm not sure that's such a good thing, given that the side panel was measured at 52C.

Based on the OT video, sounds like undervolting and biasing the front fan is a much better solution in the end.

 

[Bonusround]

Based on the OT video, sounds like undervolting and biasing the front fan is a much better solution in the end.

Or: buy a card that doesn't employ a 'flow-through' design.

The new Radeon's design is intriguing. A solid IO plate so no rear exhaust, but exposed fins on top – looks like it mostly exhausts upward. A two-slot version could be a great fit in the A4.

 

[archagon]

Not that I disagree, but "buy a card" is not an easy thing to do these days if you're building a new PC and don't want to wait half a year for hardware to become ubiquitous...

 

[eddy178]

So i was thinking how come no one has tried a custom CPU/GPU water cool loop?
I'm thinking of using the LT cpu plate/pump combo with the EKWP block for the 3080 FE which should measure around 200mm giving me clearance to put a 92mm rad on the bottom + a 92mm on the GPU side with a slightly modified 120mm bracket. The rad on the asetec is 97 or so wide so it would fit snug with the 3080 FE water-cooled at around 200mm.
So there would be a Full loop CPU/Rad/Rad/GPU.
I was thinking about a reservoir and i saw a custom one on this same thread but also saw that if you bleed it right it doesn't need it.
I think its possible and could be epic, i wish i had @dondan CADs to try to fit everything and consider which fitting would work for the GPU side, probably the low profile ones will do fine. Also with that custom PSU bracket for more flow and custom cabling.

Any thoughts on this @dondan ? could you at least confirm that 2 92mm rad would fit?

 

[archagon]

OK, ran a 40 minute Unigine Heaven 4.0 Extreme test for 40m, with PSU intake facing out. Fans are at 100%, GPU is stable at 83C, and clocks average out to 1850MHz. Room temp is around 80-82F. Will try undervolting next.

 

[thelaughingman]

Any thoughts on this @dondan ? could you at least confirm that 2 92mm rad would fit?

go crazy kid