DAN C4-SFX

[mkoclega]

The average 280 radiator is 320mm in length. This is longer than the case itself.
[...]
For the C4-SFX 2mm is the maximum thickness for the glass to look good. Now I need to find a factory, that can do this with smooth edges, tempered and black tinted. I will search for it, but currently I have only acrylic. It would be also possible to make the panels here in Germany, because here are factories that can do it - but the price will be high!

You do not have to be compatible with every 280 mm rad on the market. Even if the case is compatible with only one 280 mm rad model, that would be huge. So many people ask/dream about this for SFF cases. Keep in mind that 280 mm rad has ~40% more active surface than a 240 mm rad.
Take a look at Alphacool ST30 280 mm. It is only 297x144x30mm and its all corners are rounded so there would be some room for case screws/joints. And it is German

For the glass/acrylic panel, the reason I will not buy a Sliger case is their awful acrylic panels. If you go into acrylic only, I will not buy C4-SFX neither...
If you really care that much about 1 mm too thick glass panel, just offer two options: 2 mm acrylic (that would perfectly fit) and 3 mm TG panel. Or make a poll.
For the glass panels, you can ask Lian Li. Their panels for the TU150 case are pretty nice and not too much tinted.

 

[fiendishdrwu]

That TG news is a blow. My gut feeling is that acrylic doesn't really belong on a ~£200 premium case. But I can appreciate the problem. Presumably even if you could get 2mm thick tinted TG, there's a real risk of it being fragile at that thickness?

The photos look good though. Will be interesting to see what people think once they've had hands-on time.

Tempered glass is the only safe glass option for a computer case, however, the reason for it being significantly safer than regular glass is it's brittleness. 2mm is way too thin for tempered glass, not a lot of pressure could cause it to shatter. Acrylic while not premium is the most feasible option, short of asking Lian Li to make significantly thicker panels.

 

[Arboreal]

I didn't think that I would prefer the circular brushed button; but it gives the front panel a little lift, as the textured one is almost hidden but not enough to make the look super clean.
This isn't the case for 280 rads, it has always been a 240 only concept as far as I see it.

 

[warspitebattleship]

Well, you do not need sff to put it on desk, it is supposed for moving or travel. I built for friend system in dan a4 and it travelled across oceans and continents. I travel with current louqe a lot, and it fits cabin luggage even for many lowcost.

When you ask for this ridiculous watercoolers, zillion slot videocard, why you go for this formfactor? there are plenty big itx for this. Dan A4 was a miracle, it needs to be updated because cpu thermals jumped to the sky, not to fit everything in this universe. All you ask just creates yet another ncase m1. And yeah, dont forget, you can build with vertical card in ncase.

 

[dondan]

@mkoclega Also the ST30 is ~315mm your 294mm spec is wrong. It is for every 280 rad the same. Left chamber 15mm, 2x 140mm and 20mm tube chamber.

 

[McPhee]

Like McPhee says, acryllic just doesn't fit on a high end case.

To be fair, I stated that I feel like it doesn't belong. I'm quite willing to be proven wrong. Dan has the prototypes. If he feels the quality is good enough, then fair enough.

Even with an acrylic side panel, the C4 may be the best option for what I want; a small, windowed ITX tower without having to jump through hoops to buy one.

 

[mkoclega]

When you ask for this ridiculous watercoolers, zillion slot videocard, why you go for this formfactor? there are plenty big itx for this.
[...]
And yeah, dont forget, you can build with vertical card in ncase.

Plenty? Ncase M1 and what else? With premium look of course. Forget about bad-looking Sliger, Raijintek, Geek etc. cases. And Ncase M1 is not a good option for custom loop + window. So basically there in nothing to choose from in the ~13-15 L segment.
On the contrary in the ~10 L segment you have Ghost S1 with tophats, Nouvolo Steck (with tophat), FormD T1, A4-SFX, Streacom DA2, Mjolnir. The new C4-SFX will be just another one like them.

 

[dondan]

Dan has the prototypes.

No all past pictures are made by LianLi. But the samples are on the way

So basically there in nothing to choose from in the ~13-15 L segment.

This is a very special range and I do not understand why it has to be in it. You can get the beautiful 17L Streacom DA2 and it fit your 280 radiator. Don't get me wrong I also think 280 radiators are the pefect radiator size when it comes more extreme water cooling while beeing in a normal size, but this would require to change the length of the case from 315mm to 345mm and this it's not going to happen.

 

[schn1tt3r]

Why is it every time someone wants to make a compact case, there are people that come in and ask for it to fit a bigger radiator? The other day I even saw someone asking for 320 rad support... why not just go ATX at that point.

 

[Sijnk]

Because people want SFF with the potential to cool a 3950X and a 2080ti under water and with an okish ambient sound. And all the sff cases of the past showed, that a 240 rad is not enough for it. This is why.

 

[schn1tt3r]

If people really want that, let's see how well the Sliger SV590 really sells.

 

[Sijnk]

In addition:
With you find other solution to connect the sides to the case, then this space consuming pins from lian-li, you can be still quit small, but have a 280 rad support.

 

[Sijnk]

The sliger is no sleek enough, because it is to tall and it need to much space overall. Also, there are some details, which are not worth the money. The power button for example. You can see a review from optimum tech.

 

[fiendishdrwu]

Why is it every time someone wants to make a compact case, there are people that come in and ask for it to fit a bigger radiator? The other day I even saw someone asking for 320 rad support... why not just go ATX at that point.

People are incapable of grasping the notion of "cool, silent, compatibility and compact...pick 3". The same people who complain about their power bills when they turn on the AC all summer.

 

[McPhee]

I don't envy the job of designing these cases. A third of the posts in here are from people complaining that the case is too big, and how the original 9.85L design was better, and a third are from people complaining it's too small and needs 280mm radiator support. The remaining third are from people who seem somewhat content and are looking forward to the release. How much space is being argued over? About the amount occupied by a large bottle of Coke ?

I can see why people want 280mm radiator support. Improved cooling support is never a bad thing. But 9.85L to 10.8L to 11.1L to 12.2L is quite the size creep. That's a 24% increase in volume from the original concept. And where does it end? The case is still too narrow for many GPUs to fit in tower layout. So maybe it should be wider? Then you aren't far off being able to fit some of the smaller 120mm fan tower coolers. Should it be a bit wider again? And drive support; only 2.5" drives? But then how am I supposed to fit my 12TB 3.5" HDD so I can have everything in one box? And what if I need a bigger PSU to power all of this? Can we have ATX PSU support too? Oh look, if we change the internal layout around we can now even fit an ATX motherboard and... oh, wait... that looks a lot like a Cerberus X now ??

The other day I even saw someone asking for 320 rad support... why not just go ATX at that point.

I thought that was a joke?

 

[McPhee]

I should add, I sympathise with the gap in the market not being filled. Given the plethora of different, but ultimately fairly similar sandwich and console cases there are, you'd think there would be more choice between 10 and maybe 16/17 litres (above that, the selection seems better).

It's odd. But given the number of "May as well just buy an Ncase M1" comments levelled at this case, maybe not hugely surprising. Are case designers giving the M1 a wide berth?

 

[Paullawr]

Update:

We see light at the end of the tunnel. The only missing part for the prototypes is the USB-C internal cable.
In the last week Lian Li got some power button samples with different surface finish and some panels with silk screen logo printing. Here are two pictures:

Circular Brushed Power Button:

Sand Blasted Power Button:

Last week I asked you about 3 Slot support for classic layout and I made the decision to add this feature. So, after I made my decision on the position for the power button and the need of USB-C front I/O based on the current prototypes I will order the final prototypes.

Thank you, stay safe
Daniel

The case is literally rocking it. Either button works for me!

 

[fiendishdrwu]

I don't envy the job of designing these cases. A third of the posts in here are from people complaining that the case is too big, and how the original 9.85L design was better, and a third are from people complaining it's too small and needs 280mm radiator support. The remaining third are from people who seem somewhat content and are looking forward to the release. How much space is being argued over? About the amount occupied by a large bottle of Coke ?

I can see why people want 280mm radiator support. Improved cooling support is never a bad thing. But 9.85L to 10.8L to 11.1L to 12.2L is quite the size creep. That's a 24% increase in volume from the original concept. And where does it end? The case is still too narrow for many GPUs to fit in tower layout. So maybe it should be wider? Then you aren't far off being able to fit some of the smaller 120mm fan tower coolers. Should it be a bit wider again? And drive support; only 2.5" drives? But then how am I supposed to fit my 12TB 3.5" HDD so I can have everything in one box? And what if I need a bigger PSU to power all of this? Can we have ATX PSU support too? Oh look, if we change the internal layout around we can now even fit an ATX motherboard and... oh, wait... that looks a lot like a Cerberus X now ??




I thought that was a joke?

The people who actually need a 280mm are barking up the wrong tree if they're looking for sub-15L. The people who actually need 280mm rads are people who are using their PCs primarily as workstations, in addition to all the features you have listed. CPU hardware beyond 3700x really doesn't make any difference for gaming and if you're using the PC as a workstation, it doesn't need to be portable. In fact if you were serious about using it for work you would actually avoid going as compact as possible because you want to get work done faster, and thermal throttling will impede that.

 

[McPhee]

The people who actually need a 280mm are barking up the wrong tree if they're looking for sub-15L. The people who actually need 280mm rads are people who are using their PCs primarily as workstations, in addition to all the features you have listed. CPU hardware beyond 3700x really doesn't make any difference for gaming and if you're using the PC as a workstation, it doesn't need to be portable. In fact if you were serious about using it for work you would actually avoid going as compact as possible because you want to get work done faster, and thermal throttling will impede that.

That part of the post was satirical; not meant to be taken seriously. The point was, where do you stop? Whose requirements should be ignored? While volume doesn't bother me quite so much personally, there does need to be a cut-off point.

I'm pretty sure sub-15 litres with a 280mm rad and decent cooling performance is possible though. One of the DA2 documents on the Streacom website lists the main chassis dimensions as 180×234×340mm, which is 14.3L. Using that as a base, swap the panels for ones with better ventilation (like the ones on the M1), make the "Performance Panels" slim fan mounts standard, and ditch the shroud. That should perform very well.

 

[mkoclega]

You can get the beautiful 17L Streacom DA2 and it fit your 280 radiator. Don't get me wrong I also think 280 radiators are the pefect radiator size when it comes more extreme water cooling while beeing in a normal size, but this would require to change the length of the case from 315mm to 345mm and this it's not going to happen.

Both DA2 and M1 have classic layout so you cannot use glass panels with them as the GPU would be blocking all the airflow. With glass panels you have to have as good airflow between bottom and top as possible. Even with regular alu panels, DA2's thermals are not the best, according to Optimum Tech.
You sure about 345 mm? Even if ST30's spec in incorrect, there still are 310-315 mm long rads on the market.