DAN C4-SFX - old

[giraffesinmybalcony]

mate look whos getting his pants twisted lmfao

You need to stop getting your pants all twisted because people have differing opinions. I am seeing nothing that is directly insulting or disrespectful. Disagreeing with Dan on some of his decisions is not disrespectful, even if you think it so. Dan is just one man, and he's not always right. If anything, the only outright time I saw insulting commentary tbh was when Dan himself insinuated that people who didn't like his new idea were blind because they 'could not see' the benefits of it. Felt pretty underhanded (because he was directly undermining the opinions of those who knew the benefits but didn't like the new design direction), even if I myself am pretty direct about how I feel with some of the decisions he takes.

We (the users) rightfully do not concern ourselves about the business aspect of the case, because it doesn't affect us in the slightest. We're just users of a case. That's not our job, it's Dan's. He can either listen to us or ignore us.

 

[Tephnos]

mate look whos getting his pants twisted lmfao

11/10 reply.

 

[prefinem]

Oh right I forgot how far we jumped in 'the future' since A4-SFX was released. How long was it a couple years ago? I feel old myself now.

M.2 are the norms now are they not? Maybe not for current purchase PC's, but for new PC's off the self.

Am I get you right that having a benefit of saving 250 ml of volume would make you happy (and many others)? If so - Im not from those 'others' because of common sense.

It’s wasted space. It’s probably more than 250ml because cable routing, mounting and airflow. Why would I want that since M.2 drives exist?

It's solely your decision to have it like that. I don't have a server in my apartment so my PC requires to have some storage beyond common 512 GBs. That just proves nothing tbh.

I mean, I have a TB in one and it wasn’t expensive. They have 1TB drives for less than a couple hundred now so what’s the problem?

"SFF is not for you" - oh really? For you then?

Eh, that was more a remark on your unwillingness to compromise. The validity of it is purely opinion based.

And frankly speaking 2-3 x 2.5 drives and 'ton of storage' is not actually gets along very well so it's still a (moderate) sacrifice. By having only couples of m2 is a radical one.

Wait, 2-3 2.5" drives is a sacrifice? I mean, why are earth are you even looking at SFF if that is a sacrifice.

[/QUOTE]Umm OK, enlight me then what are SFF are meant for? I'm asking because I've seen a lot of SFF cases that are actually 'close' to that.[/QUOTE]

Name a good SFF case under 100? (Node 202? it's not really that great) That means that SFF is in general more expensive than normal PC cases. Now lets look at PSU's, or CPU Coolers, or in this case, M.2 vs SSD vs HD. SFF is going to cost more, and making it cost less most likely means diverging from being a SFF Case

As for expandability, well I mean, come on. If you want a small case, chances are it won't be that expandable.

------

I feel like you don't really want a SFF, but just a well designed small case. May I suggest the H200 or Evolv Shift?

For me, I want a well designed SFF case that I can game off of. I will gladly concede any part of the PC if a better / smaller version can be found. The C4 looked to be that case. Not sure anymore, but we will see.

 

[Tephnos]

Must say I do find it a bit amusing how I was adamantly hard against any increases in size but I honestly don't think the addition of a single 2.5" is that big of an issue, given the above conversation. 3.5" yeah sure, I can argue against that one all day.

 

[muSashi]

Anyone know when the new renders will be released?
And I too want Dan to keep the side IO if possible.

 

[FunkEngine]

People complaining about cost of SATA m.2 vs 2.5" SSDs confuse me. This is going to be an expensive case. It's an enthusiast tier product in a niche within a niche. I don't want to sound like an elitist, but if you're on a tight budget this is probably not the case for you.

I also don't understand the people who went out and bought some of the largest GPUs around while knowing that they were interested in going SFF. Even in an ATX build those 3 slot cards are enormous.

 

[chyll2]

imo, a well designed and optimized sffpc case for 200-250 dollars is not an expensive case especially when you consider that some BIG ITX case easily cost 100 to 150 with having less desirable finish and Quality.

I agree 3.5" should never be part of discussion but 2.5" drives should be included.

 

[Bonusround]

TFW you've already dedicated sizable volume for oversized graphics cards: "why can't I have a little 2.5" drive, too?"

 

[elsac]

TFW you've already dedicated sizable volume for oversized graphics cards: "why can't I have a little 2.5" drive, too?"

I'm not saying people are wrong for wanting the 2.5'' drive mounts, but I always found 3M Dual Lock tapes to be better than normal mounting mechanisms for SSD. SSDs are so light that those tapes act as perfect mounts. You can mount anywhere and remove and reattach whenever you want. I use them a lot for my SFF builds. They even make for good fan mounts.

 

[elsac]

I mean, I have a TB in one and it wasn’t expensive. They have 1TB drives for less than a couple hundred now so what’s the problem?

I have 4.5 TB storage in my laptop, so 1 TB is really low for regular use. Even though storage has become cheaper, content has become larger. But I have to say that I would go for a 3TB 2.5'' HDD than 2x 1TB SSDs if storage volume is my priority. I don't really want to do the cable management for 3x disks.

M.2 are the norms now are they not? Maybe not for current purchase PC's, but for new PC's off the self.

M.2 is still severely limited in storage capacity, considering most ITX boards have only one, with max being 2. I really wish Samsung would release the QVO in M.2 as that would mean you can have 4TB on dual M.2 motherboards without using SATA at all.

Edit: Seems like QVO is coming in 4TB. This seems great. Now my laptop can have 8.5 TB just for **** and giggles.

 

[dondan]

If the C4 would be a exreme compact sub 3L system i would aggree with you that M.2 is enough. But we are speaking of a 10-11L system. With support for big GPUs, watercooling and big air cooling and with "flex" in the project/develope name. So I made the decision the system should support 2x 2.5" drives for both configuration - sandwich and classic.

 

[keshon]

So I made the decision the system should support 2x 2.5" drives for both configuration - sandwich and classic.

I have mixed feelings right now. Happy for having 2.5 on board and sad that the amount of them is less than in A4-SFX.

 

[Metroversal]

I have mixed feelings right now. Happy for having 2.5 on board and sad that the amount of them is less than in A4-SFX.

Well, at least you'll get better CPU Cooling, better GPU compatibility, more I/O ports compared to the A4. Seems reasonable to me.

 

[schn1tt3r]

Must say I do find it a bit amusing how I was adamantly hard against any increases in size but I honestly don't think the addition of a single 2.5" is that big of an issue, given the above conversation. 3.5" yeah sure, I can argue against that one all day.

The initial argument was having one 2.5 and side ports or two 2.5 and no side ports. I would assume, in a wold where m.2 exist, the majority would rather side ports instead of the second 2.5 mounting slot. Two m.2 drives in the motherboard and one 2.5 slot should be more than enough for anyone building on this case, but some people can't let go of old tech.

EDIT: And as for review sites pointing the lack of a second 2.5 slot all dan would need to do is add a strip of double sided tape labeled "SSD mounting tape"

 

[ToutNoir]

EDIT: And as for review sites pointing the lack of a second 2.5 slot all dan would need to do is add a strip of double sided tape labeled "SSD mounting tape"

With some marketing it would become "a 2.0 ultra-thin lightweight back to back SSD mouting device".
Instant win.

 

[RockZors]

Are the only mounts behind the front panel?

 

[Metroversal]

Alternatively, if you REALLY want many 2.5" Drives you can always use a 120mm AIO cooler and take advantage of the unused space. Simple as that!

Clearly, at the cost of reduced CPU cooling (still better than the A4) but hey everything has a price.

EDIT: I did a quick search and this is what I've found
https://www.ebay.com/itm/5-25-to-3-...ay-Cooling-Fan-Mounting-Bracket-/171994678479
(also supports 3.5" Drives for those of you who are interested)

 

[prefinem]

I have 4.5 TB storage in my laptop, so 1 TB is really low for regular use. Even though storage has become cheaper, content has become larger. But I have to say that I would go for a 3TB 2.5'' HDD than 2x 1TB SSDs if storage volume is my priority. I don't really want to do the cable management for 3x disks.

4.5 TB? That's insane, no offense. I have a 1TB in my desktop and over half is unused, granted, I have access to servers and such, which if I didn't, I would need more.

M.2 is still severely limited in storage capacity, considering most ITX boards have only one, with max being 2. I really wish Samsung would release the QVO in M.2 as that would mean you can have 4TB on dual M.2 motherboards without using SATA at all.

There are 2 TB M.2 drives already. They are just insanely expensive

If the C4 would be a exreme compact sub 3L system i would aggree with you that M.2 is enough. But we are speaking of a 10-11L system. With support for big GPUs, watercooling and big air cooling and with "flex" in the project/develope name. So I made the decision the system should support 2x 2.5" drives for both configuration - sandwich and classic.

Glad a decision is made.

 

[Brude27]

If the C4 would be a exreme compact sub 3L system i would aggree with you that M.2 is enough. But we are speaking of a 10-11L system. With support for big GPUs, watercooling and big air cooling and with "flex" in the project/develope name. So I made the decision the system should support 2x 2.5" drives for both configuration - sandwich and classic.

At this point in the development of the C4, I feel you need to be as direct as you were here @dondan . Not everyone is going to be happy with every decision you make, but I know I much prefer knowing the direction rather than reading through 4-5 pages of people arguing over the unknown... and I'm sure there are others that share that sentiment.

 

[FoskcoRS5]

At this point in the development of the C4, I feel you need to be as direct as you were here @dondan . Not everyone is going to be happy with every decision you make, but I know I much prefer knowing the direction rather than reading through 4-5 pages of people arguing over the unknown... and I'm sure there are others that share that sentiment.