Log Portable workstation: A4 H2O w/ 280 radiator

[hrh_ginsterbusch]

From everything I have read including actual benchmarks by pros the faster RAM means little if anything in real world performance, at least on games, maybe some on production work....

I tested Samsung DDR5 4800, then ran it at 5400, then tested some Ripjaws CL32 at 6000 then at 6400, not a bit of difference in any test worth noting.

The article I read that had the most testing I think they went as far as 7400, nothing gained to consider.

Seems buying the fastest RAM is like buying the fastest car but not really knowing what to do with it(most do not and should not try)

There are a few tests by der8uer and Hardware Unboxed, that show its only really relevant in some games = a few more FPS.

And it still heavily depends on timings and the RAM (quality) itself. Faster = better? That only is up to 6000 MHz, and mostly relevant with AMD. Above the numbers even got worse (at least in the IRL tests).

Edit: JayzTwoCents does a nice comparison.



Cant seem to find the one by der8uer, but it was just a sub-element in a bigger test of something entirely else, where he got extremely fast-timed but "slow on MHz" RAM vs. 7200 MHz "fast" RAM and that shows .. mostly its not worth it to buy fast-frequency RAM (6000+) but better timings (CL30) still make a difference.

Thus I ordered DDR 5 5600 with slightly better than normal CL timings.

cu, w0lf.

 

[hrh_ginsterbusch]

This morning I got the positive reply by Caseking whether their listed - but not visibly named - Inno3D Twin X2 White is indeed the Stealth variant. It did show it in the images, but not in the description, so I nagged them a bit. Only took them 2 days to reply and fix the missing product information

Alas, right after I ordered it and already got a DHL parcel tracking code, albeit its still "open", ie. probably goes out in a few hours or tomorrow. AFAIR DHL tends to fetch business mail in the late afternoon or early evening.

cu, w0lf.

 

[RAAM]

I have been playing catch up in the past 6 months or so when I got back into building PCs, watched read hundreds of articles and watch dozens if not hundreds of videos, I think I watched that one by Jayz2c....thanks for posting it, will watch again!

Glad you figured out the GPU situation, I bet you are excited to get it

Rick

 

[hrh_ginsterbusch]

Inno3D RTX 4070 OC White Stealth arrived on Saturday. It sits, it fits. Just perfect! Also allows for using the original PCIe riser cable that comes with the A4-H2O

Now I just oughta figure out how to mount everything safely, then put it all together with the i5-12400 as a test CPU.

Test system specs are everything as seen in the initial post, but:

- CPU: Intel i5-12400
- RAM: 32 GB RAM, Corsair Vengeance 5600, CL 36
- Storage: SK Hynix P41 as main system / boot drive
- OS: preparing the drive for multi-boot, going to test current MX Linux (KDE), Endeavour OS and some KDE-focused Ubuntu derivate, picking the one that works best for the initial boot loader


cu, w0lf.

 

[RAAM]

Great! Looking forward to pics, if you post.

I am trying to figure out how you used the stock riser cable, in front of the MB?

Glad you started this thread as got me looking into this case and I really like working with it

Rick

 

[hrh_ginsterbusch]

Great! Looking forward to pics, if you post.

I am trying to figure out how you used the stock riser cable, in front of the MB?

Glad you started this thread as got me looking into this case and I really like working with it

Rick

The stock riser is normally meant to be routed behind the MB, to the top and then down, but you also instead can just route it "forward" towards the MB side again - at exactly that point where it would normally be routed down to the GPU side..

Thanks to it being slightly longer than people might think it is it also allows for that direction (a lot of folks on r/sffpc reporting having issues with the riser cable "being too long" by about 2 - 3 cm).

I figured that out mostly by testing out different riser cable scenarios, including several daisy-chaining ones.

cu, w0lf.

 

[RAAM]

Weird, I think my riser cable is a bit shorter than others because it was not long enough to put the GPU up top no mater what I tried. I wonder if the batch the seller had was an early run version and they changed the cable length later on....

 

[RAAM]

Things are going well here. running two Arctic BioniX P120 directly off the GPU, doing a great job and quiet. I found the adapter cables for around $8 each. Also found a $10 90 degree 8 pin cable that helps the GPU fit better in the case, I wish it was 10 or 20mm longer though it works running between the fans as I have them spaced to do the most good over the heatsink.

I have 140mm nylon filters taped to the inside of the cover over the MB and PST area and the Arctic P140 PST slim fan over the MB, experimenting with opening up areas to see if needed, might have to cut up some filter material to tape over them.

Bottom has 80mm Arctic P80 PST and three 80mm fitlers, had to cut one a bit shorter to fit.

Everything running at acceptable noise and heat levels even in 80+ F ambient room temps(26.66c) though of course a bit better in 70F, 21.1c ambient.

I tired the Silverstone 120mm Air Slimmer in place of the slim 140mm Actic and it was far louder, did not expect that.

I am very impressed with the Arctic BioniX 120 and 140 fans I am running, do a great job, quiet, affordable.

Once I am settled on everything, nearly there, I will cut and splice cables to get rid of excess, clean up the install and better air flow.

Also going to open up the PS mount, cut out the area over the PS, already removed PS grill and drill some holes and make slots above the PS into the bracket as the filter goes over that area. Then test everything for air in and out to ensure all air going in is filtered.

Fan Control app, not working due to Avast, have to disable it to try again, actually looks like uninstall it, might have to find a different virus, etc, program, just testing the free one. I want to be able to really fine tune the fans, water pump, have them all work together, etc...

And still have work to do on the VRM cooling, TMPIN2 gets pretty hot, not sure which is which, 0, 1 and 2.....not sure how to find out as have searched.

All in all this has been great fun and you have been a great help in getting there, thanks very much

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Now, how about yours? Anything you want to share, etc, would be enjoyed.

Sincerely,
Rick

 

[hrh_ginsterbusch]

Weird, I think my riser cable is a bit shorter than others because it was not long enough to put the GPU up top no mater what I tried. I wonder if the batch the seller had was an early run version and they changed the cable length later on....

Nah, it seems to be correct. When I did a recheck with it right now, I noticed I had the cable moved out of the back to the "front" of the mb side, which allows for more movement, but would touch the mb underside.

So I set out with my weird riser-ipede again - A4 + Meshroom S combined - and the total required length would be 30 cm. Technically I already got that ("straight" 30 cm), but not as a "double reverse" riser cable.

Gonna see how far I can get with the normal straight one, and if it fails, its back to ordering stuff again *sighs*

cu, w0lf.

 

[RAAM]

I understand, a bit in the same situation, to make the current cable fit it can rub the back of the MB which could lead to not so pleasant results if it were to wear through at some time. Pretty sure I am going to stay with the current layout and order a 30cm cable with 180 end instead of bending the flat end cable like I am using into a 180 to make it work. The cable with 180 end should fit in better and prevent any future penetration of the wiring jacket.

Or, I will take a look and see if I can make a guide to ensure the cable cannot touch the back of the MB as the cable I have allows for better air flow since individual wires instead of ribbons.

 

[hrh_ginsterbusch]

Ok, after playing around with the riser-ipede a bit more, I came up with this batshit crazy option: Having enough rizer cables and cards sitting around IS helpful, after all

Ie. I combined the riser-ipede again, but moved the smaller cable to the bottom, ie. the one from the Meshroom S, then routed it back and over the top as planned, and THEN added the 90° angled riser card bracket, including pushing the cable a bit downward. Et voila! It sits, it fits

cu, w0lf.

 

[RAAM]

YEAH!
Got to feel great getting it sorted out
Rick

 

[hrh_ginsterbusch]

For properly mounting the radiator: What would work best and be the most simple / basic option, would be to run two straight metal rails / plates with lengthened holes from the top to the bottom of the case. Basically two very simple radiator brackets. Only thing to do would be the screw / mounting holes for these brackets.

Currently trying to figure this out, one option might be a slim side extender with like 5 - 8 mm width that has indents, so the brackets would sit flush to the case side, but mounted on the side extender, which by itself is mounted to the case by the default Lian Li mounting pins.

cu, w0lf.

 

[hrh_ginsterbusch]

Got a bit of prep work done: Added the 32 GB RAM, primary SSD, and the be quiet SL 2 backplate to the mainboard. Also studied the MB manual and Asrock website to find out that one can replace the bios without CPU installed, too. Which I intend to do, because apparently this board comes with the very first BIOS version, which was released in 2021.

Either Asrock never decided to ship them with current bios versions, or this thing has been sitting at Caseking since forever

Aside of that, did a bit of cable clean up to figure out whether or not I need to get rid of the front IO. Looks like it might still work out.

Further studying of the MB revealed: If this is your first time installing a power button connector, you gonna fail at least once. Compared to the manual of the MSI B760, it doesnt tell you in which direction you have to install the connector, while the MSI manual clearly shows the correct directions.

cu, w0lf.

 

[RAAM]

Riser cable, mine is indeed proper length but if I use it there is not room for the other side of the GPU to fit down into the case, 4 or 5mm to tight.

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I am still working on ideas to try for the radiator mount. As mentioned mine is so tight front to rear of the case corners it holds in place very well with just pressure fit then added cloth electrical tape, very adhesive and a bit of heat seems to cure it making it even a stronger bond, hard to take it off.

Since I want to seal the bottom slot below the radiator and leave the top open with a filter over it have to rethink what I was considering. I need more airflow for both the AIO and GPU so I might leave top and bottom slot above and below the radiator to allow more air flow. I would have to cut some strips of nylon filter to fit over them and tape it on with the same great tape.

On that note I am looking for some taller feet for the bottom, take the strip off and at least double the height and use round legs for more airflow into the bottom of the case. I likely have some in storage, going there tomorrow most likely.

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I found that the case fan header does not work on the MB, might be why it was "refurbished" OK with that as already worked around it so not a big deal but going to check to ensure latest Bios, pretty sure installed it, just in case it has something to do with it.

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I am still rather enjoying us both building the same case with 280 AIO cooling

Rick

 

[hrh_ginsterbusch]

Riser cable, mine is indeed proper length but if I use it there is not room for the other side of the GPU to fit down into the case, 4 or 5mm to tight.

I may have to rely on a 15 cm riser that runs on the front of the case instead - currently the fan of the radiator, located right behind the mainboard, feels a bit .. choked. Might be enough to just switch positions of the fans (the one on the right is currently the slim one).

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I am still working on ideas to try for the radiator mount. As mentioned mine is so tight front to rear of the case corners it holds in place very well with just pressure fit then added cloth electrical tape, very adhesive and a bit of heat seems to cure it making it even a stronger bond, hard to take it off.

Since I want to seal the bottom slot below the radiator and leave the top open with a filter over it have to rethink what I was considering. I need more airflow for both the AIO and GPU so I might leave top and bottom slot above and below the radiator to allow more air flow. I would have to cut some strips of nylon filter to fit over them and tape it on with the same great tape.

My current option is using 4 x 6 cm 90° brackets. Those fit very well, just need to figure out how to attach them to the bottom of the case. Probably either some "flat connectors" or just .. drill holes at resp. locations.

On that note I am looking for some taller feet for the bottom, take the strip off and at least double the height and use round legs for more airflow into the bottom of the case. I likely have some in storage, going there tomorrow most likely.

If you find something, do tell me; I've been looking into this as well. Might go with looking into custom 3d printed ones, but if that fails, might just create my own by using pre-cut wood blocks or so (drill holes / insets using the dremel and then just replace the current short rubber ones).

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I found that the case fan header does not work on the MB, might be why it was "refurbished" OK with that as already worked around it so not a big deal but going to check to ensure latest Bios, pretty sure installed it, just in case it has something to do with it.

Easily fixed with an additional fan controller board, there are various small-sized options floating around on Amazon - some of them allowing direct control using dip switches

cu, w0lf.

 

[RAAM]

"I may have to rely on a 15 cm riser that runs on the front of the case instead - currently the fan of the radiator, located right behind the mainboard, feels a bit .. choked. Might be enough to just switch positions of the fans (the one on the right is currently the slim one)."


Good luck sorting it out, I am sure you will get it just where you want the performance and cooling

As well as brackets for the radiator

I am pretty much stuck with what I have right now but working well enough, I wanted to try the fans blowing down onto the GPU card and did but a bit hotter and made the CPU quite a bit hotter. The only other options I can come up with, main one, is fans below GPU blowing up but the card would block a lot of the airflow on the front half of the card.
And more riser cable issues, also contributing to less air flow and more parts needed to try out.
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Taller feet, temp solution, dead induction cook top feet, had to drill them out to fit the screws that came on the stock mounts, about twice as tall and only around 15-20mm in diameter as they taper up, looks great. But, temp solution, I need to do a bit better job, it was a quickie I did while taking a break from our RV remodeling and getting my highly modded Fiesta ST running again. I have another set I will take more time on, so far though it will have much better air flow.

For the next set I will dig through my thousands of screws to see if I have some direct fit or go buy some at the local hardware store just 3 miles away, heading there often now anyway to our storage space.

Wooden feet would be cool, can have rubber bottoms, even better

3d printed....I will have to get a printer one of these years when done with all the RV, etc projects.

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I have an arctic fan hub in the FR case but left it in as so well setup, will take it out if I sell as parts instead of a system or most of one. My buddy gave me another one but all the pins are exposed, smaller, not sure I want to use it. If I can get better control of the AIO fans as the curves are not that great in iCue software with Fan Control, have it running now but not setup yet....I just want the fewest parts and cables I can get by with, cleaner looking and better air flow.

 

[hrh_ginsterbusch]

Taller feet, temp solution, dead induction cook top feet, had to drill them out to fit the screws that came on the stock mounts, about twice as tall and only around 15-20mm in diameter as they taper up, looks great. But, temp solution, I need to do a bit better job, it was a quickie I did while taking a break from our RV remodeling and getting my highly modded Fiesta ST running again. I have another set I will take more time on, so far though it will have much better air flow.

Found some decently looking rectangular ones on Amazon that I'm gonna try soonish (after looking at the one sold for Sliger cases over at density.sk: those are just 1 cm tall, so waaaay too low).

For the next set I will dig through my thousands of screws to see if I have some direct fit or go buy some at the local hardware store just 3 miles away, heading there often now anyway to our storage space.

Wooden feet would be cool, can have rubber bottoms, even better

3d printed....I will have to get a printer one of these years when done with all the RV, etc projects.

there is folks on etsy that do that stuff, just asking politely might work out (its what I'm considering rn).

 

[hrh_ginsterbusch]

Ordered yesterday and arriving today soonish:

a) 3 cm tall (or short) rectangular rubber feet. Really, its quite hard finding something like this on Amazon. I mean, if all fails? I just gonna use the case feet of the AP201. Its going into the "archive" anyway after I've moved all out of it

b) 140 mm fan grills, because the PCIe riser-ipede is kinda threatening to be swallowed by the fan as soon as I quick-start the AIO

cu, w0lf.

 

[hrh_ginsterbusch]

Update: Oh my, those "rectangular black furniture feet" fit like a glove underneath the original ones.
Maybe one could even re-use the pre-existing screws! And if not, I could just use double-sided adhesive and .. make it sticky-stuck together!


The Amazon Germany link doesnt work, because the product is not available at Amazon.com (and the auto-replacement on SFF.net breaks it), but I found these which are very similar, albeit a bit smaller (by 5 mm):

https://t.ly/QW459

Original Amazon Germany, URL shortened: https://t.ly/HB0OE

cu, w0lf.