DAN C4-SFX

fatpolomanjr

Caliper Novice
Aug 20, 2019
23
32
Why no update? I wouldn't mind a "no longer doing this" or "postponed until 2020" just any communication would be nice.
Unfortunately it appears the update was that there would be no update for a while. X(

In the long run, if the consumer doesn't hold the producer/developer accountable, it's bad for the consumer. As a consumer in this case (no pun intended), I will offer suggestions, ask the hard questions, call out the bs, and congratulate/celebrate the successes throughout the process. If you search my account posts, you'll see I stay true to all of those things in the many threads I follow.
What you're saying is correct, but you can't apply that logic to any of us, since none of us are consumers of the case yet. We're prospective consumers until we make a purchase. Ask the hard questions and call out the bs when we are promoted to consumer.

I can't really speak to sales of this case being dead on arrival due to arriving late to market, since if it is a better design and of better quality than the rest it should sell just fine.
 
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Brude27

Cable-Tie Ninja
Jun 21, 2018
194
291
@fatpolomanjr Thanks for a decently thought out, and well written point of view. While I appreciate your take on what I said, I still disagree with your premise. Yes, we are all prospective consumers in this particular circumstance, but that can be said for literally anything any of us have ever considered buying, but didn't.

I'll use the upcoming Google Pixel 4 launch as an example. That phone has a successful predecessor, and has been in development and discussed ever since the Pixel 3 launched. If Google up and decided to ghost the entire world who was excited and, in the case of the C4, helped in the development of the Pixel 4... are you going to tell me the world wouldn't have something to say about it just as I and several others have on this forum? Google might be a bad example, as they are one of the few "untouchable" companies in the world, but the idea is the same.

This forum exists as a platform for developers to garner interest and build a product that consumers would want to buy. We are all prospective consumers in every thread we take the time to read here. I understand and agree that Dan doesn't owe us a thing, but I do have an issue with the idea that newcomers to the forum can still get their hopes up for a product that is going no where. I stand by everything I've said, and my opinion remains that this thread should be labeled as stalled until Dan decides to pick up the project again.
 
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fatpolomanjr

Caliper Novice
Aug 20, 2019
23
32
@fatpolomanjr Thanks for a decently thought out, and well written point of view. While I appreciate your take on what I said, I still disagree with your premise. Yes, we are all prospective consumers in this particular circumstance, but that can be said for literally anything any of us have ever considered buying, but didn't.
Which makes us hobbyists. I only bring up the consumer thing because I think it is disingenuous to refer to any of us as such, when we haven't had the opportunity to spend a dime on this project. Until that happens we don't get much say as consumers.

If Google up and decided to ghost the entire world who was excited and, in the case of the C4, helped in the development of the Pixel 4... are you going to tell me the world wouldn't have something to say about it just as I and several others have on this forum?
What could phone enthusiasts say other than "well I guess it's time to look to other companies for a new phone that's actually going to be made"? It's a disappointment, sure, but at some point you just move on. Maybe bump to ask for an update every now and then, but that's about the extent of it IMO. Disappointment is one thing. Salt is another, and is the result of what we think we're entitled to not being fulfilled. Just because we're disappointed by the stalled progress doesn't mean we have a right to be salty or angry at the project runner.

I love that Dondan is sharing his development on this project and asking for input so he can release a product we all really want in the end. While I wish that it were delivered to my doorstep a month ago, hey I'll still enjoy reading and wondering about whatever he has time to share.

This forum exists as a platform for developers to garner interest and build a product that consumers would want to buy. We are all prospective consumers in every thread we take the time to read here. I understand and agree that Dan doesn't owe us a thing, but I do have an issue with the idea that newcomers to the forum can still get their hopes up for a product that is going no where. I stand by everything I've said, and my opinion remains that this thread should be labeled as stalled until Dan decides to pick up the project again.
Agreed. Or he can just keep the original post updated with his June reply explicitly stating for no one to get their hopes up for now. The only crime here is hobbyists new or otherwise getting their hopes up because they hadn't seen the latest update.
 

Brude27

Cable-Tie Ninja
Jun 21, 2018
194
291
Which makes us hobbyists. I only bring up the consumer thing because I think it is disingenuous to refer to any of us as such, when we haven't had the opportunity to spend a dime on this project. Until that happens we don't get much say as consumers.
So, I called us consumers, and you countered that we are prospective consumers... I’m good with that. I’m actually in full agreement there, and your correction validated my point even more... but back peddling from your own correction for the sake of digging your heels in on Dan’s behalf is a bad look, and isn’t productive. I say that b/c...

Agreed. Or he can just keep the original post updated with his June reply explicitly stating for no one to get their hopes up for now. The only crime here is hobbyists new or otherwise getting their hopes up because they hadn't seen the latest update.
...we are clearly both in agreement here. Whether we are consumers, prospective consumers, hobbyists or whateverthenextthingisyoucomeupwith... it doesn’t change my original stance that you have now said you agreed with.
 
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fatpolomanjr

Caliper Novice
Aug 20, 2019
23
32
You're right that whateverthenextthingIcomeupwith to refer to us doesn't matter, as long as consumer isn't among those names. Since in that case we are entitled to Dondan making good on our investment. (Spoiler: we still haven't paid a dime.)

There's nothing wrong with your original stance about listing this project as stalled. It clearly is, based on Dondan's own words. I just see little difference between that and what's already been posted by the project runner. What I disagreed with was you going on about how you feel it necessary to defend the rights of consumers, which is totally irrelevant to the current situation for reasons I've already mentioned. Thankfully you and I seem to already have come to a consensus on that point.

If my goal were to change your stance on listing this project as stalled (which wasn't my goal), then sure, what does my opinion matter in this "consumer or not", "stalled or in progress" discussion? If doing so lessens the amount of salt in this thread, then by all means. My opinion was only meant to be a counter-vote to some of the opinions expressed in this thread about a product we haven't even paid for, and wouldn't even know of if it weren't for the creative designer sharing it with us in the first place.
 
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JDK

Average Stuffer
Sep 25, 2018
65
65
Yes, we are all prospective consumers in this particular circumstance, but that can be said for literally anything any of us have ever considered buying, but didn't.
Ah, so that's why every company has to listen and talk to everyone about any of their upcoming/potential products. 🤪

I'll use the upcoming Google Pixel 4 launch as an example. That phone has a successful predecessor, and has been in development and discussed ever since the Pixel 3 launched. If Google up and decided to ghost the entire world who was excited and, in the case of the C4, helped in the development of the Pixel 4... are you going to tell me the world wouldn't have something to say about it just as I and several others have on this forum? Google might be a bad example, as they are one of the few "untouchable" companies in the world, but the idea is the same.
You should come down from your "I want to speak to the manager!" Karen-like attitude.
If Google decided to ghost the world on the Pixel 4 people would have to say exactly nothing about it. Some would be frustrated or gleeful, sure, but the world would move on.

I understand and agree that Dan doesn't owe us a thing, but I do have an issue with the idea that newcomers to the forum can still get their hopes up for a product that is going no where. I stand by everything I've said, and my opinion remains that this thread should be labeled as stalled until Dan decides to pick up the project again.
I am really not sure you do.
If your whole outcry is just about some thread label on the forums, so you don't get emotionally invested any more, you should probably write a moderator.
 

Brude27

Cable-Tie Ninja
Jun 21, 2018
194
291
You're right that whateverthenextthingIcomeupwith to refer to us doesn't matter, as long as consumer isn't among those names.
I think you're focusing too hard on the word "consumer" with this. We are either producers or consumers in a given market. Producers obviously make the products consumers are looking to buy, and consumers are looking to buy said products from the producers. I'm in full favor of classifying the type of consumer we are by describing it as a "prospective consumer", b/c as I said... it only drives my point home further, but you continuously saying we aren't consumers yet b/c we haven't spent money on this particular case is still wholly false. In this scenario, if you own a computer case, you are in fact a consumer.

What I disagreed with was you going on about how you feel it necessary to defend the rights of consumers...
As a consumer, I will in nearly all situations defend the rights of consumers. It would be pretty counter-intuitive for my place in society otherwise.

If my goal were to change your stance on listing this project as stalled (which wasn't my goal), then sure, what does my opinion matter in this "consumer or not", "stalled or in progress" discussion? If doing so lessens the amount of salt in this thread, then by all means. My opinion was only meant to be a counter-vote to some of the opinions expressed in this thread about a product we haven't even paid for, and wouldn't even know of if it weren't for the creative designer sharing it with us in the first place.
Well said. Your opinion matters as much as mine does, which is to say they don't... particularly when the person our words are for isn't reading them.

Thanks for the solid discussion @fatpolomanjr. @JDK went full internet on me, so I'm going to leave it here for now. Cheers.

-Brude
 
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fatpolomanjr

Caliper Novice
Aug 20, 2019
23
32
In this scenario, if you own a computer case, you are in fact a consumer.
Generally speaking, yes, I'm a consumer, however I'm not a consumer of this case, and neither are you or anyone in this thread. I get that we're consumers generally speaking, but it is impossible for us to be consumers of a case that hasn't been bought and paid for yet. So what I'm saying is wholly true, because being a general consumer of SFF pc cases does not mean I am a consumer of the Dan C4-SFX, a case that no money has been transferred to fund or otherwise acquire.

Does adding "of this case" to the word "consumer" help clarify what I'm trying to say? I'm not trying to re-write my definition of what we are again and again, but that's what I've been trying to get across this whole time.

As a consumer, I will in nearly all situations defend the rights of consumers. It would be pretty counter-intuitive for my place in society otherwise.
Of course, as any reasonable person should do, generally speaking. But I will still make the case that this reasoning is only necessary and applicable to someone who's wallet has been violated with the emptying of funds for the production or purchase of this case. Meaning that I will not stop harping on the non-consumer aspect. If you say that we Consumers are also Consumers of the Dan C4-SFX, then your statement is 100% false.
 
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THeRoSSMaCHiNE

What's an ITX?
Sep 25, 2019
1
10
Hey @dondan =)
I'm a very happy A4v2 purchaser, very hopeful C4 purchaser.
Super excited and looking forward to being able to get my hands on this case.
Almost can't believe what I've read in this forum regarding the development of the C4.
The whole process is long, and catering to all is tough, but as an audience, I suspect we all want this case.
It's been 2 long years since the C4 page 1 post, and I'm glad you're listening to us.
I'm hopeful that you're still plugging away, working hard to make this case a reality.
Please accept some encouragement (loads of it) from me, and from everyone who is in the same boat.
We love your work. You're a legend.
Ross in Australia xo
 

FAQBytes

SFF Lingo Aficionado
Feb 22, 2017
91
102
Captain's log.
Day 403

Today I picked up an alien lifeform, called a "hekkin' chonker", he appears to like human music and has informed me that his name is Sheev. Though he looks very angery, Sheev is very nice.



Still waiting on signs of the Dan-C4.

Captain, out.