SFF.Network AMD Talks Ryzen: Memory Support, Mini-ITX and Game Performance

Ryzen has had an active post-launch development, in which AMD has supported developers and manufacturers with code, guidelines and microcode updates to further increase performance and support of its hot new CPU platform.

Forbes has had an interview with AMD’s Ryzen Product Manager James Prior and Head of Global Technical Marketing Robert Hallock. They discuss game and app optimization needed to make full use of Ryzen’s platform, along with memory performance and compatibility.

Read more here.

 

[grumpyrobin]

On page 3 of the forbes article he touches up on mini itx.
x370 and b350 x300 are the same functionality wise in a mini itx form factor, it's just that x300 has extra space on the pcb, for wireless or gigabit ethernet.

So my guess is that all the people that want wifi, need to wait for x300 mobos.

 

[jØrd]

Regarding future releases, is there anything you can tell us about the availability of mini-ITX AM4 motherboards? We’ve seen Biostar use the X370 chipset with its mini-ITX motherboard, which is interesting as a lot of enthusiasts assumed high-end mini-ITX boards would use the X300 chipset which was made with mini-ITX in mind. However, we haven’t seen any images of boards from other manufacturers yet.

James: So we recently saw Biostar introduce two models that use the B350 and X370 chipsets on mini-ITX. These sold out instantly in North America and we’re going to see them ramp their production worldwide. Biostar hasn’t been a popular name in recent years but they’ve beaten everyone else to the market so all credit to them. The rest of the manufacturers will likely have their samples ready in the next month or two. They’re all very close. Typically there’s usually a lag in the release of mini-ITX motherboards behind the rest of the field. Manufacturers focus on the majority field, which is always ATX.

It’s also interesting to see them use the X370 chipset – as you said, we built the X30 chipset just for small form factor designs so the thinking there was that they didn’t want to bring mini-ITX and the new X300 chipset to market at the same time. The X370 chipset is a known quantity for AM4 motherboards. As we push forward with more small form factor designs, we’ll see more chipsets being used that can really address the different areas of the market. You’ll get the guys that focus on lower price boards, but right now they’re dealing with the enthusiast builders that set the scene.

Robert: Regarding the chipsets, I think there was also something lost in translation with the X300 chipset in particular. Being a socket-on-chip, Ryzen has all the things such as PCI-E, USB and SATA built-in, which is not dissimilar to any other CPU on the market today. You only need one chipset on the board to provide these features and this can be X300, B350, X370, we don’t care. All of these chipsets are available to use in any form factor – but we did create X300 specifically for cases where the vendor will want to add a companion chip to the PCB of the mini-ITX board and doesn’t have enough space on the board to do that. Here, X300 might be a good solution to that to free up board real-estate to add one of these cards such as Wireless LAN or 10GB Ethernet controller or some other feature that our chipsets don’t provide by default. So with regards to the X300 chipset, it’s just one option for mini-ITX, it’s not the only option – we’re happy for them to use any chipset so we weren’t necessarily surprised to see someone using X370 on mini-ITX. Manufacturers have had experience with Intel’s Z270 chipset so they know how to use a traditionally-sized chipset on a mini-ITX motherboard.

 

[Phuncz]

What I get from the interview, X300 is a smaller chip, maybe without a (large) heatsink to clear even more board real-estate.
I can't wait to see what they'll be able to cram on an mITX board.

Sorry @3lfk1ng still no talk about Micro-ATX

 

[3lfk1ng]

Yea, this wait is so painful. The only thing keeping my sanity is knowing that I am also waiting for the Cerberus.
My R7 is sitting on my desk collecting dust just waiting for an mATX motherboard to drop. I'm really hoping we'll get some announcements at Computex. Even @LukeD is waiting for some enthusiast mATX boards to drop.

Regarding the article, I'm super interested to see how this whole Infinity Fabric concept will all play out with regards to memory speeds.
I have ton of really intense theories but I will reserve most of them until RX Vega drops. Here are just two of my theories:
- Possibility that two GPUs wouldn't need a game engine to natively support Crossfire: it will just work.
- Possibility to place two GPUs on one PCB without having to share memory or require API to support it.

For anyone on the outside looking in, AMD's Infinity Fabric is a 256-bit bi-directional high-bandwidth interconnect used to connect the two quad-core complexes (CCXs) on 6-core and 8-core Ryzen processors with the PCIe controller, memory controller, and the integrated southbridge (and some other things). The important part to note here is that Infinite Fabric is directly synced with the memory clock.

If you're using 2133MHz DDR4, the Infinity Fabric will run at 1066MHz.
256bits*1066 MHz*1byte/8bits = 34112 MB/s or ~34 GB/s.

However, if your memory is 3200MHz DDR4 (popular choice for Ryzen), the transfer rate becomes:
256 bits*3200 MHz/2*1 byte/8 bits = 51200 MB/s or ~51.2 GB/s.

At 3600MHz DDR4 (memory speed required for Ryzen to closer compete with 7700k in games):
256 bits*3600 MHz/2*1 byte/8 bits = 57600 MB/s or ~57.6 GB/s

From 2133 to 3600MHZ, that's a 59% increase in Infinity Fabric performance.
Pretty cool stuff.

 

[grumpyrobin]

I believe if reaching 3600mhz would be easier to achieve, even with b350 boards, it would put the nail in the coffin on the 7700k

 

[Kmpkt]

What's keeping people from just tossing in like 4266 MHz G.Skill into one of these things right now? Given the scaling, it would be absolutely beast wouldn't it?

 

[grumpyrobin]

What's keeping people from just tossing in like 4266 MHz G.Skill into one of these things right now? Given the scaling, it would be absolutely beast wouldn't it?

it wont post that high. When Ryzen first came out it was hard to get to even 2666. Now we are at 2993, and with the agesa update we should be at 3200mhz. 3600 is reachable on certain x370mobos with manual settings.

 

[Kmpkt]

So basically another instance of AMD Finewine Technology. Seriously though, that's very exciting to read. Knowing how well Ryzen scales, I imagine that it's only a matter of time before they get memory support that rivals Intel's. To think that we could hypothetically see AMD take the lead in the desktop performance race in the future regardless of clocks is pretty awesome. I'd really love to see Intel get cleaned up after the last decade of gouging and incremental performance gains.

 

[stree]

Well I don`t care a jot about how it compares with Intel, just going to enjoy my Ryzen APU with an M.2 and 16GB of 2400 ram, and that`s me happy.

 

[alamilla]

3600 is reachable on certain x370mobos with manual settings.

I wasn't aware this had been achieved!
Presumably with Samsung B DIMMS.
Do you know which mobos are posting at those speeds?

 

[3lfk1ng]

I believe it's the ASUS ATX boards.

Here is a 3.9GHz 1700x trading blows with a 5.0GHz 7700k, both on 3600MHz DDR4.

 

[grumpyrobin]

I believe it's the ASUS ATX boards.

Here is a 3.9GHz 1700x trading blows with a 5.0GHz 7700k, both on 3600MHz DDR4.

I would like to think everyone in this forum drooling over Ryzen is waiting for an x300 mini itx board that can do 3600mhz.

I just hope this wait period thing doesn't happen again once the Threadripper cpus come ...( we probably won't be seeing x399 mini itx boards until 2018 right? ? right???)

 

[alamilla]

Wendell from Level1Techs had some interesting thoughts on the X300 chipset after a trip to AMD last month.
Certainly brought some things to my attention which I wasn't aware of!

EDIT: i.e. dual NVME M.2 support

 

[grumpyrobin]

I guess this means Ryzen might snatch the mini itx scene in force. It has insane potential at the moment.

 

[|||]

While dual M.2 a possibility, I don't know if it will ever happen...I think at least one lane needs to be dedicated for any Ethernet connection; same if there is WiFi (sort of likely on a mITX board).

 

[SeñorDonut]

I would like to think everyone in this forum drooling over Ryzen is waiting for an x300 mini itx board that can do 3600mhz.

I just hope this wait period thing doesn't happen again once the Threadripper cpus come ...( we probably won't be seeing x399 mini itx boards until 2018 right? ? right???)

Would Threadripper even fit on an ITX board? It's a pretty big socket. But I sure wouldn't complain if it does (っˆڡˆς)

 

[Phuncz]

I'm not holding my breath for ThreadRipper on mITX, that socket is supposedly going to be huge and will require serious cooling. On the other hand, AM4 socket already has 8-core CPUs which rivals the i7-6800K and i7-6900K performance easily on workstation usage, so there's that.

Ofcourse having 16 cores would be even more awesome, but we have had to wait a considerable amount of time for Socket 2011-3, which was quite popular, to show up in a singular mITX motherboard.

 

[TheHig]

it wont post that high. When Ryzen first came out it was hard to get to even 2666. Now we are at 2993, and with the agesa update we should be at 3200mhz. 3600 is reachable on certain x370mobos with manual settings.

All very exciting news! I too am waiting for an enthusiast mATX board but am happy with my B350 for now. If the x300 itx boards are good I may downsize.

MSI has been great for me so far with regards to memory support. With the most recent bios I am finally booting cold with my GSkill Ripjaws V 2x8 kit at the XMP proflle simply selecting the Axmp setting in bios. 3200Mhz 16-18-18-38 1.35v. My kit is Single Ranked Hynix modules which were not even on the QVL for the MSI B350m Mortar when i purchased.

In a month or 2 I feel a lot of vendors will be plug and play with a lot of memory out there which is tremendous for the average users.

 

[SeñorDonut]

Ok, update on the Threadripper thing. I found what looks to be a photo of an SP3 socket, and it looks like it actually takes up less space than AM4. Basically what I did is I threw these two images side by side in Illustrator, traced the SP3 socket and establish two comparison points (so I assumed the capacitors in both images are the same size), and scaled the purple stuff to fit on the AM4 image. The red circles are for indicating what I assume to be the mounting holes for SP3, which is why I say it ends up taking up less space.

I do not claim any of this to be accurate though, but if it is... ( ͡● ͜ʖ ͡●)