Production Winter One -- 15.6L SFF case, 3090 Support, 3-slot GPUs, dual 280mm radiators, CFD Optimized Design

WinterCharm

Airflow Optimizer
Original poster
Jan 19, 2019
325
1,338
If I'm after a completely silent build in this case with a ryzen 5800x and radeon 6800, what is the best route? Will watercooling make a big difference?

Watercooling will generally be a bit quieter. Some of the stock fanss on GPU and CPU coolers can be annoyingly loud. However, if you air cool, and do some Noctua fan swaps, you should be able to get around that issue.

When the SPK comes, it'll hopefully be the go-to for quiet operation :)
 
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Goatee

Master of Cramming
Bronze Supporter
Jun 22, 2018
595
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I know very little about packing foams, but wonder if your looking for a novel material could laser cut cork sheets be an option? I have seen it being used in the cosmetic industry for packaging.

In terms of recycling the box and packaging (in the short term) its not something I have ever done for a sff case. Typically I keep all the case boxes somewhere safe with cases not in use inside them.
 

WinterCharm

Airflow Optimizer
Original poster
Jan 19, 2019
325
1,338
I know very little about packing foams, but wonder if your looking for a novel material could laser cut cork sheets be an option? I have seen it being used in the cosmetic industry for packaging.

I really love the idea of using Cork, but it's insanely expensive in the quantities and sizes we would need. Just the raw material at that size will cost us around $30, and that's without the machining cost of turning it into 7 stacked trays.

Laser cutting cork is a slightly cheaper option, but it goes through, so we'd need 14 sheets of half thickness, and a glue to put them together. Overall, the extra labor costs would probably even this one out. One big downside is laser cutting cork leaves a soot-like material (you are basically vaporizing wood) on the edges that gets everywhere.

In terms of recycling the box and packaging (in the short term) its not something I have ever done for a sff case. Typically I keep all the case boxes somewhere safe with cases not in use inside them.

I have also never recycled boxes for computer parts. I keep all of my boxes/packaging...

I am aware -- I also keep a lot of my technology boxes laying around. Using recycled EVA or PE foam is still better for the environment (and our carbon footprint) in terms of less carbon output than going with a newly made petroleum-based EVA or EPE, because the refining processes for those materials are not the greenest --- even if people hold onto the boxes :)
 

Goatee

Master of Cramming
Bronze Supporter
Jun 22, 2018
595
1,260
I really love the idea of using Cork, but it's insanely expensive in the quantities and sizes we would need. Just the raw material at that size will cost us around $30, and that's without the machining cost of turning it into 7 stacked trays.

Laser cutting cork is a slightly cheaper option, but it goes through, so we'd need 14 sheets of half thickness, and a glue to put them together. Overall, the extra labor costs would probably even this one out. One big downside is laser cutting cork leaves a soot-like material (you are basically vaporizing wood) on the edges that gets everywhere.

I love the feel of cork, I like the feet detailing you are doing. Its such a beautiful material.

To minimize the cost, could you "clad" some cheaper stock (paper / card / foam) to give the same effect?

On the subject of card (and assuming no expense spared), I wonder if a hardback book structure with 7 opening pages that have the instructions on one side and the components embedded it opposite page would be a good way of delivering the item and instructions.



Maybe titled "Opening a new chapter on SFF"

Then I might keep my packaging next to the case. :D
 

Post-Newt

Average Stuffer
Oct 12, 2020
86
208
I love the feel of cork, I like the feet detailing you are doing. Its such a beautiful material.

To minimize the cost, could you "clad" some cheaper stock (paper / card / foam) to give the same effect?

On the subject of card (and assuming no expense spared), I wonder if a hardback book structure with 7 opening pages that have the instructions on one side and the components embedded it opposite page would be a good way of delivering the item and instructions.



Maybe titled "Opening a new chapter on SFF"

Then I might keep my packaging next to the case. :D
 

carlover670

Average Stuffer
Oct 22, 2020
68
92
@WinterCharm you think we can get a color and finish comparison between Winter One and some sort of aluminum Apple product. If there is a difference, can you explain? Thank you and im so excited to see the final product!
 
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Ayfid

Case Bender
New User
Sep 16, 2020
2
3
Surely the carbon cost for manufacturing EVA has mostly already been paid? I can't really see buying recycled EVA resulting in an increase in demand for new EVA production, given that there is already such an "oversupply" of material to recycle.
 
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WinterCharm

Airflow Optimizer
Original poster
Jan 19, 2019
325
1,338
Surely the carbon cost for manufacturing EVA has mostly already been paid? I can't really see buying recycled EVA resulting in an increase in demand for new EVA production, given that there is already such an "oversupply" of material to recycle.

You're correct that *most* of the cost has been paid, but recycling (chopping >> melting >> heat forming into new packing) does take energy, and there is a minor carbon cost to be paid for that. :) This is much lower than the carbon cost of getting "new" EVA from petroleum since you are then taking an additional carbon cost to refine that out.

@WinterCharm you think we can get a color and finish comparison between Winter One and some sort of aluminum Apple product. If there is a difference, can you explain? Thank you and im so excited to see the final product!

Apple uses a 7000-series aluminum with a proprietary Copper alloying, which is what leads to the unique color, finish, and strength of their aluminum, letting them forego the tempering process. Thus, when they bead blast, they can do it at a slightly lower velocity, leading to a finer surface finish, and take advantage of the natural strength of their alloy.

We're using a Tempered 6061-T6 Aluminum which raises the strength beyond Apple's proprietary alloy. However, the tempering hardens our aluminum considerably. With a similarly fine particle size, our bead blast needs a higher velocity, leading to slightly rougher surface finish. Or, we can slightly upsize the beads, and use a s lightly lower velocity. We opted for a mix of these two -- a bit larger particle size, a bit lower velocity, to achieve a similar momentum transfer, scaled to the hardness of our aluminum. Visually, the two are incredibly close, with a minor color difference due to the alloying. But the 7XXX Apple Aluminum is slightly smoother to the touch than ours, and appears to have a slighly less rough surface finish.

Here's a photo of my iPad vs the Front Panel of a Beta Test Unit, under some very high CRI LED lighting.



In this first picture, you can see 6061 T6 vs Apple's 7000-series aluminum. Visually they are very close. In the second picture below, you can see 5052 (NON tempered) laser cut vs machined 6061-T6 (look towards the top, the bottom had some cosmetic damage) vs Apple's 7000-series alloy. You can see how the non-tempered 5052 got a similarly softer finish, like the non-tempered 7000-series aluminum, but the 6061-T6 Is rougher. You can also see the color differences -- 5052 looks a bit more blue, where 6061 is neutral grey, and 7000-series is a bit brighter.



We dropped laser cut side panels on the final version due to QC and tolerance issues -- CNC costs more, but the tolerances are so much better, and there's far less warping (this was especially an issue on holed panels)... so the final versions of the case will be made of 6061-T6 throughout, (with just a few small parts will being laser cut, like the power button key switch holder). It should also help make colors easier to match.

For color matching 5052 / 6061, scaling, and inventory reasons, the interior parts of the case (no matter the color you get) will always be black. The bottom, top, front, back, side panels, and feet will all be 6061-T6 and anodized in the chosen color.

I love the feel of cork, I like the feet detailing you are doing. Its such a beautiful material.

To minimize the cost, could you "clad" some cheaper stock (paper / card / foam) to give the same effect?

On the subject of card (and assuming no expense spared), I wonder if a hardback book structure with 7 opening pages that have the instructions on one side and the components embedded it opposite page would be a good way of delivering the item and instructions.

Maybe titled "Opening a new chapter on SFF"

Then I might keep my packaging next to the case. :D

While the book idea is really neat, it would be a *very* thick, and unusually large book. Winter One's current packing dimensions are 14"x14"x4". Adding a spine, hinge, and more complexity to that would make the packaging very heavy. the panels will need considerable padding between each of them to not be damaged in shipping.
 
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hwytodangerzone

Caliper Novice
Oct 15, 2020
21
40
Weird question, what's the clearance between the bottom plate and the bottom of the PSU / GPU? I'm trying to do some pre-planning on pump+res and I'm looking at ways of possibly using the flat EK 120 in either ddc or d5.
 
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carlover670

Average Stuffer
Oct 22, 2020
68
92
What’s the time between the first batch 1 diliveries and first batch 2 deliveries? Will batch 2 orders open before or after the first batch 2 deliveries.
 
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spyfly

Efficiency Noob
Oct 20, 2020
5
6
Managed to order an RTX 3090 FE from notebooksbilliger today. Now I just need a Corsair SF750 to power this GPU powerhouse and the Winter One Case 😜

@WinterCharm can the EU funders still count on a delivery this year? 🤔
 
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WinterCharm

Airflow Optimizer
Original poster
Jan 19, 2019
325
1,338
Thank you, really, for giving us all so much insight into the manufacturing process. I feel like I've learned a lot about all the little details it takes to get something made.

Thank you. I enjoy going into the details because each of those considerations has some effect on the final product, and none of the decisions are taken without context.

Weird question, what's the clearance between the bottom plate and the bottom of the PSU / GPU? I'm trying to do some pre-planning on pump+res and I'm looking at ways of possibly using the flat EK 120 in either ddc or d5.

Oooh, good question. 10.5cm (105mm) to be safe. (There is a bit more room, as the fan radiator plate is another 2.5mm above the inner surface of the bottom plate) -- that total distance is closer to 10.9cm (109mm).




What’s the time between the first batch 1 diliveries and first batch 2 deliveries? Will batch 2 orders open before or after the first batch 2 deliveries.

Batch 2 Orders will Open After Batch 1 starts shipping, but depending on timing it might be a bit before Batch 1 delivers. We really need to ship out one batch before we can open orders, because I don't have space to warehouse lots of orders in flight at this time. There's already a plan in place to tighten up the time between orders and people receiving cases, hopefully down to 20 days or so. What I can say is I would expect everyone in Batch 1 to have a tracking number before batch 2 opens.

Managed to order an RTX 3090 FE from notebooksbilliger today. Now I just need a Corsair SF750 to power this GPU powerhouse and the Winter One Case 😜

@WinterCharm can the EU funders still count on a delivery this year? 🤔

Setting up final production is tricky, and I'm still waiting on a few inspection reports. This is currently delaying official "production start" even though orders are in, and materials are ready (pending some awaiting inspection). This will smoothen out soon, but I'm worried we may not hit our december shipping dates right now.

I just found out about it a few hours ago, so I'm waiting for more information so I can make a proper announcement during this weekend's Kickstarter update. I will (hopefully) know more by then, but it's very likely at this point we're going to miss our Christmas delivery date, and have to push into the month of January. That's the cost of doing this right and having some unexpected delays, unfortunately. But if I had to pick between delivering something that disappointed, and delaying a bit to delight all of you, I would choose the second one every time, without question.

That being said, Regardless of where you ordered from, orders will ship out on the same day. While shipping times may vary from region-to-region, we want everyone to receive their cases as quickly as possible.