Prebuilt [SFFn] ASRock's DeskMini A300 - Finally!

[burninator]

First post here - bear with me

Has anyone figured out how to get cTDP to work under AMD CBS settings?

My 2400g goes to 95C during a Milkyway@Home BOINC load in less than 30 seconds. I'm using a shroud-less wraith stealth at 2000rpm. I've triple checked my MX-4 paste application and it seems fine.

My first thought was to check if the board had cTDP settings in the BIOS. It seems to have them under the CBS settings but changing the setting doesn't seem to actually do anything.

I've set it to both "commercial/consumer" (why are there two?) 35w & 45w (from the default 65w) and both don't appear to do anything. HWinfo reports up to 140W CPU+SoC power at full load regardless of the cTDP setting. It's driving me nuts. The computer is thermal throttling. Any advice? If I can't figure this out I'm going to have to return the 2400g.

 

[GLSRacer]

I have not messed with these BIOS settings so hopefully someone else with a similar setup will chime in. I have the same setup as you, though my fan is set to go to full as required and I have not encountered such high temps with my system running Fedora 30. I usually sit around 75C during heavy benchmarking. I would check the thermal paste again and verify that nothing is blocking the fan or other outlets. The cable management seemed to be fairly important as certain cables could block internal airflow if positioned improperly. Worst case, you could set the processor limit to something less than 100 in the Windows power settings. This will throttle the processor and prevent overheating until you can locate the problem with your system and correct it.

 

[m4758406]

@burninator

my english bad, hope you understand following ...

my machine ...
ASRock DeskMini A300 (Austrian Shop 136€)
1.) AMD Ryzen 5 2400G bulk (Aliexpress, got it cheap --> 86€ )
2.) CPU-Cooler JONSBO HP-400 (Aliexpress 18€)
3.) CPU-Fan Noctua NF-F12 PWM, 120mm (Austrian Shop 12€)
4.) Kingston HyperX Impact 16GB 2933 CL17 (Austrian Shop 82€)
5.) Samsung SSD 970 EVO Plus 500GB, M.2 (Amazon 93€)
6.) SSD-Copper-Cooler 67x20x4mm (Aliexpress 2,8€)
7.) Thermal-Silicon-Pad 100x100x1mm RV77 (Aliexpress 1€)
8.) USB-2.0 extansion Cable 30cm - 2 Port (Aliexpress 2€)
9.) TIEGEM OTG-Cable USB-C to USB 3.0 - 5Gbps (Aliexpress 3,7€)
10.) SATA III extension cable M/F - 22 Pin (15+7) (Aliexpress 1€)

I did following cause forum wrote it is good to do (for lower power consumption and other positive things):
1.) Core Performance Boost --> deactivated
(burninator i think this is most important setting for you, it lower voltage)
2.) Enabled S4+S5 --> activated (this setting is not easy to find, for me all is stable cause AMD wrote at UEFI S4+S5 can be unstable)

Tried 35w and 45w settings once.
I think only 45w setting made little bit difference, 2 wattage lower power consumption but do not remember exactly.
I think it is not worth to use it.
Better you safe energy with much better cooling system, my cpu-fan only need 0,6 wattage max. cause it is 120x25mm huge.
And it is very very quiet.

Also do not understand why commercial / consumer should be good. There is not any documentation about uefi settings. Also per google i find nothing about all uefi settings

 

[ConsolidatedResults]

First post here - bear with me

Has anyone figured out how to get cTDP to work under AMD CBS settings?

My 2400g goes to 95C during a Milkyway@Home BOINC load in less than 30 seconds. I'm using a shroud-less wraith stealth at 2000rpm. I've triple checked my MX-4 paste application and it seems fine.

My first thought was to check if the board had cTDP settings in the BIOS. It seems to have them under the CBS settings but changing the setting doesn't seem to actually do anything.

I've set it to both "commercial/consumer" (why are there two?) 35w & 45w (from the default 65w) and both don't appear to do anything. HWinfo reports up to 140W CPU+SoC power at full load regardless of the cTDP setting. It's driving me nuts. The computer is thermal throttling. Any advice? If I can't figure this out I'm going to have to return the 2400g.

The CPU can jump several tens of degrees in seconds, but even will full CPU and GPU load 95°C after 30 seconds for me appears a bit too high for a Wraith Stealth with 2400G, unless you live at 30++ C ambient? What's ambient and what's idle temp at normal fanspeed?

I would not trust the HWinfo wattage readings, they make little sense. Have you checked Ryzen Master as well?

The cTDP settings appear to work from my observations in Ryzen Master, at least in BIOS 1.20 (where there is only a single config, no commercial / consumer). However, they will still allow the processor to boost, which uses very high voltage and thus causes excessive power draw, generating heat. Then as temp goes up and resistance, even more excessive power draw, trying to keep the processor boosting while it really can't anymore, adding more heat. Vicious cycle.

Try disabling boost first. This should significantly lower power draw and temps (and as the processor won't hit boost clocks sustained anyway, you are not really missing much). If still too excessive, you can underclock the highest P-State. For me this appeared to be the best way to significantly lower power draw and thus thermals.

To quote myself from earlier in the thread:

• Set cTDP to 45W/35W and / or disable boost. With a 2200G on CPUz CPU Stress i got the following readings from Ryzen Master:
  • cTDP Auto (65W), Core Performance Boost Enabled -> 3700MHz All Core, 50W CPU Core, 1.3625V CPU Core
  • cTDP 45W, Core Performance Boost Enabled -> 3650MHz All Core, 46W CPU Core, 1.3125V - 1.33125V CPU Core
  • cTDP Auto (65W), Core Performance Boost Disabled -> 3500MHz All Core, 37W CPU Core, 1.20625V - 1.2125V CPU Core
• The TDP Setting can be found in Advanced -> AMD CBS -> NBIO Common Options -> System Configuration. BIOS P3.40 has the wattages in "Consumer" and "Commercial" configurations, not sure what that does. I have tested on P1.20 which only has one config per wattage.
• Core Performance Boost is found in Advanced -> AMD CBS -> Zen Common Options -> Core Performance Boost

And the results from fiddling with P-States at https://smallformfactor.net/forum/threads/sffn-asrocks-deskmini-a300-finally.10553/post-147902

 

[ConsolidatedResults]

[/QUOTE]

little bit google translated cause my english poor )
...
Thats my cooling solution.
1.) "Jonsbo HP-400" with own made copper sheet metal duct.
Cooper is 0.6mm thick.

I really like this! One question though, why did you install the HP-400 with the heatpipe bends facing the back? Does it not fit the other way around, that way the fins should be almost exactly under the fan grille?

 

[m4758406]

Turning 180 degree does not work.
Cause the "cpu-part" is not in the middle.

 

[m4758406]

The cooler for ssd just has room.
The ssd-cooler is for fun, it was cheap

Copper sheet was trash, I got from a very small sheet metal bending company.
I gave him 5 euros and said thank you !
Space between M.2 and Radiator _2
You do not need a lot of metalworking tools, small bending plier, riveting pliers, shear, drilling machine with rivet drill, ruler, ...
Before making the copper, you make it out of cardboard, as a template.
Space between M.2 and Radiator _3
Space between M.2 and Radiator _4

 

[m4758406]

google translated, my english is poor ...

Before I ordered the 120mm Noctua ...
I calculated all the air holes of the housing and the fan.
Added all cross sections (mm²).
(I am from Austria, thats why its german written)

So I came up with the idea that after the warranty period, the housing holes over the fan, there are 361 holes.
That you can drill up. With a 5mm drill.
This increases the air cross section from ~3191 to ~5115 mm².
The NF-F12 PWM has ~8761 mm² but can only use ~7688 mm². Because the fan is round, and the case square
Therefore in 2 years I will enlarge the 361 square holes with a 5mm drill. Then my fan need much less energy.
That's my calculation. I have also calculated the remaining housing holes, it is about ~3975 mm².
Therefore, the air access is much larger than the departure after drilling. This creates a nice overpressure, the warm air is pushed even better to the outside. The NF-F12 PWM is built to handle high pressure very well, it has wide blades.

After that i made a list of possible fans, wrote all technical data into this Excel-list

 

[yck3110]

with the latest bios of a300, is it allowed to overclock the cpu and igpu of 3400g?

 

[Valantar]

with the latest bios of a300, is it allowed to overclock the cpu and igpu of 3400g?

No.

 

[yck3110]

No.

Does anyone tried to use some previous version the a300 bios to overclock the 3400g?

 

[ConsolidatedResults]

Does anyone tried to use some previous version the a300 bios to overclock the 3400g?

Yes. Overclocking does not work in any BIOS. Neither does overclocking via Ryzen Master, nor via Ryzen NB SMU Tool https://github.com/FlyGoat/ryzen_nb_smu or any of the tools derived from it. Underclocking works fine. All info is in this thread. While people, me included, are willing to pay for a mod for OC and other features, this has unfortunately not yielded a workaround: https://smallformfactor.net/forum/t...ios-for-the-asrock-a300m-deskmini-a300.10567/

 

[m4758406]

Never used overclocking settings.
I am not a gamer.
Using this machine for stock market research.
And sometimes watch videos (series, onlinechess, ...)
I have 2400G.
I want strong CPU and weak GPU.
Is it possible that i can reduce GPU, to safe some wattage ?
But the CPU should stay at maximum !
Or is the GPU already very economical, at idle, that I will not achieve any gain ?
Maybe someone can give me a little guide, so I do not have to try hundreds of settings
Thank you !

 

[Valantar]

Never used overclocking settings.
I am not a gamer.
Using this machine for stock market research.
And sometimes watch videos (series, onlinechess, ...)
I have 2400G.
I want strong CPU and weak GPU.
Is it possible that i can reduce GPU, to safe some wattage ?
But the CPU should stay at maximum !
Or is the GPU already very economical, at idle, that I will not achieve any gain ?
Maybe someone can give me a little guide, so I do not have to try hundreds of settings
Thank you !

The system should regulate GPU/CPU power allocations within TDP automatically, and unless the GPU is being stressed somehow its power draw will be negligible - a couple of watts at most. Undervolting is a far better strategy to extracting maximum performance out of the system, as that will lower power draw at a given clock speed and thus allow the CPU to either boost higher or for longer, or run cooler overall. If the GPU is being taxed to a sufficient degree for it to take power away from the CPU then either it is doing something useful (in which case underclocking it or similar will harm performance) or something is loading the system unnecessarily and a better strategy would be identifying the source of the workload and disabling/closing/uninstalling the offending application.

 

[scobiehague]

Hi. I'm looking to purchase a Deskmini A300 with Noctua NH-L9A fan. Will the following components allow it to post correctly to perform a BIOS update?

• Corsair Vengeance Performance SODIMM 16GB DDR4 3000MHz 2x8GB
• AMD Ryzen 5 3400G VEGA Graphics AM4 CPU

I've read conflicting reports as to whether BIOS older than 3.50 can boot Picasso APUs with faster RAM timings.

Also, is it possible to underclock the 3400G to use a portable charger such as Krisdonia 50000mAh?

Thanks for any help.

 

[Choidebu]

Also, is it possible to underclock the 3400G to use a portable charger such as Krisdonia 50000mAh?

Thanks for any help.

Nice thinking there d^_^b - I like where this is going.

From the spec alone it is possible with dc 19V(20V) out, which should support up to 80W-ish.

The A300 itself comes with 120W 19V brick, but apu max tdp is just 65W, so I believe it should be doable with undervolting / underclocking.

That power bank is 185Whr, with 80W max output that means theoretically you get 2 hours on full charge with peak load, give or take.

With PASSTHROUGH capability you can use your included brick to charge the powerbank and power the system simultaneously, essentially making a battery backup for the A300. The voltage and wattage is also perfect - 2A for charging (38W), 80W for system, voila ~120W.

However (there's always one isn't it...) while more or less same width it's 4cm longer and adds 3cm thickness to an already bulky 8cm A300, so say you smack those (I'm getting ahead of myself here) two together, say behind the motherboard side, we're looking at bounding box of 195x155x120mm cube, 3.627L of portable 1080p gaming rig. Excluding the brick, of course...

Whatever you do please do post back.

 

[LostEnergy]

Findings of mine:

1. The Asrock A300 & Wraith Stealth cannot be run semi-passive. A bit of airflow is needed for the adjacent parts, and the APU reaches throttling threshold if passive with the occasional process you'd reasonably run on such a home-server (like, Nginx). Now throttling won't do anything, but eventually it gets hotter than 85°C which I deem unsafe in 24/7 passive use.
2. Temps are lower when the device stands on its side, in “Portrait mode.”
3. If you experience sound stuttering in games with headphones via the 3.5mm jack, do make sure to use Linux 5.3.0 or later. (Ubuntu? → google HWE)
4. Put a small o-ring (like the ones used to silence Cherry keys in mechanical keyboards) under the mainboard, front right (the memory sticks being on the ‘left side’). That'll dampen built-up of vibrations some experience with the machine in “landscape mode” (resting on its largest side).

For power-saving and scripts:

1. The edid files contain information about your screen(s), corresponding to the connected output (display port, HDMI…). See:
   

   tail -n+1 "/sys/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:08.1/0000:04:00.0"/drm/card0/card0-DP-*/edid

   … and, for example, if your screen were connected to “DP-1” you can use that in scripts as follows:
   

   [Unit]
   ConditionACPower=true
   ConditionFileNotEmpty=…/drm/card0/card0-DP-1/edid

   … which would have the systemd unit run iff a monitor were switched on. (Please note that ‘switched on’ is not the same as ‘turned on.’)
   Start downloads, transcoding, updates, depending on whether someone's in front of the screen and so forth. :-)

 

[scobiehague]

The A300 itself comes with 120W 19V brick, but apu max tdp is just 65W, so I believe it should be doable with undervolting / underclocking.

That power bank is 185Whr, with 80W max output that means theoretically you get 2 hours on full charge with peak load, give or take.

Thankyou for the detailed response.

Can anyone confirm that the 3.50 BIOS will still allow underclocking? I need to upgrade to it if I order a 3400G.

Or would a 2400G be more suitable/safer for underclocking to use with such a powerbank as the Krisdonia? The extra power of the 3400G may come in handy, but I'd forgo it if it gave me the flexibility to run off a portable battery.

 

[pappl]

Since RAM is important for iGPU performance i don't know which fast RAM-Kit will work with Ryzen 3400G (Bios 3.50)?

My selection:

- 16GB G.Skill RipJaws SO-DIMM Kit 16GB, DDR4-3000, CL16-18-18-43 (F4-3000C16D-16GRS) ~80 €
or
- 16GB: G.Skill RipJaws SO-DIMM Kit 16GB, DDR4-3200, CL16-18-18-43 (F4-3200C16D-16GRS) ~155 €
or
- 32GB: G.Skill RipJaws SO-DIMM Kit 32GB, DDR4-3000, CL16-18-18-43 (F4-3000C16D-32GRS) ~145 €
or
- 16GB: Corsair Vengeance SO-DIMM Kit 16GB, DDR4-3000, CL16-18-18-36 (CMSX16GX4M2A3000C16) ~110 €
or
- 32GB: Corsair Vengeance SO-DIMM Kit 32GB, DDR4-3000, CL16-18-18-39 (CMSX32GX4M2A3000C16) ~200 €

Which of these are Dual Rank (better performance)? ?

Which have been tested with A300 already? ?

Any recommendations?


Thanks, pappl

 

[ConsolidatedResults]

Can anyone confirm that the 3.50 BIOS will still allow underclocking? I need to upgrade to it if I order a 3400G.

I remember BIOS 3.50 brought back the AMD PBS / CBS Menu. Custom P-States, which are needed for underclocking, are in that menu. They are also in BIOS P1.20, where underclocking works (1.20 does not work with your 3400G). Sorry I can not fully confirm though

Since RAM is important for iGPU performance i don't know which fast RAM-Kit will work with Ryzen 3400G (Bios 3.50)?

Which of these are Dual Rank (better performance)? ?

Which have been tested with A300 already? ?

Any recommendations?

Thanks, pappl

Any 32GB Kit (2x 16GB) is almost certainly Dual Rank (2 banks of 8x 1GB ICs each). For 16GB Kits (2x 8GB) I would suggest to check with the specsheet.

Almost all modules should work, some early RAM issues have been long been worked out (since BIOS 1.20)

Forum member @ShamedGod has posted quite a bit about his experience with G-Skill Kits in this thread.

Dual Rank should offer better bandwidth, but to me looks like it doesn't like to clock as high as single rank. The A300 generally does not appear to have issues with high RAM speeds, it may just be hampered by only allowing 1.35V DIMM. I was able to boot single rank to 3600 and run a benchmark on it. I would probably look for single rank unless you want 32GB, in which case as above you are likely limited to Dual Rank anyway.

If you want a 32GB kit, I personally can confirm the plain Crucial 3200 SO-DIMMs work fine even on Raven Ridge. To add, they are on the Asrock Memory QVL for Picasso and for me the 32GB kit CT2K16G4DFD832A (3200 MHz 22-22-22-22 nominal) runs 3333 16-19-13-16 @ 1.35 Volt. 3400MHz is still stable but have to loosen tCL to 18. Picasso might even perform better with the kit.