Advice Optimum Tech - Ncase M1 Dual Radiator Clone with available parts

[ermac318]

You should be able to control the pump speed using DC voltage control. Look into how you can do that with your motherboard BIOS. PWM is always nicer but DC control is alright too.

 

[r3load3d]

I also have a DDC310 and Iceman res in my Ncase build. Even at 8V (approximately 1900RPM) it is clearly audible, however much better than at full speed. I have ordered one of these replacement PCBs to add PWM control, I'm hoping that it will allow me to get the pump down to 1000RPM or less.

 

[Danglos]

Hi I just joined to comment.

This week completed my Iceman Ncase M1 build. I found swapping from the EK PE 240 to a Hardware Labs Black Nemesis GTS 240 (I think that's the name) and from EK velocity to a Heatkiller CPU block shaves about 5 degrees. I'm using Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut as you paint the thermal paste across the whole block. Finally using EK 3.2 PWM though for some reason I had to modify the Iceman to get it to fit. It's very quiet. I went a bit overboard and added a Quadro and flow and temp sensors to the loop. Getting 28-30 now at idle on my i9 10900k. Just need to swap my 980 Ti for a 3080!

For QDC I used Koolance QDC3 as they were the only ones available.

 

[christyles]

Hi I just joined to comment.

This week completed my Iceman Ncase M1 build. I found swapping from the EK PE 240 to a Hardware Labs Black Nemesis GTS 240 (I think that's the name) and from EK velocity to a Heatkiller CPU block shaves about 5 degrees. I'm using Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut as you paint the thermal paste across the whole block. Finally using EK 3.2 PWM though for some reason I had to modify the Iceman to get it to fit. It's very quiet. I went a bit overboard and added a Quadro and flow and temp sensors to the loop. Getting 28-30 now at idle on my i9 10900k. Just need to swap my 980 Ti for a 3080!

For QDC I used Koolance QDC3 as they were the only ones available.

Can you share your parts list?

 

[Danglos]

I hope this works: Google Drive Folder I'll try and knock up a list but to be honest this shared google drive has screenshots from most vendors and PDF prints from Amazon UK. I know realise I bought a lot of parts and really this was an insane build. Originally I had a parts list but eventually I went crazy and bought things I thought i might need. The RAM listed is 16gb as I swapped this into my old PC to get 32gb from it for this build. The CPU was from CEX because they owed me £205 on voucher for a defective GPU.

Hopefully this share works

 

[morj]

@Danglos regarding the DDC pump: I don't think the motherboard header can provide the required wattage, so it's expected that a DDC pump has SATA/Molex power and a PWM connector which you can plug into a motherboard or a fan controller.

 

[ermac318]

@Danglos regarding the DDC pump: I don't think the motherboard header can provide the required wattage, so it's expected that a DDC pump has SATA/Molex power and a PWM connector which you can plug into a motherboard or a fan controller.

Many newer motherboards have 2A fan headers for pumps, which can support the power of even a D5 pump. But most of them are wired for Molex+PWM and sense wire for speed control (if they have PWM at all). It's possible to re-wire them to a fan header, but you have to always be careful about which header you plug it into then.

 

[Danglos]

I hope this works: Google Drive Folder I'll try and knock up a list but to be honest this shared google drive has screenshots from most vendors and PDF prints from Amazon UK. I know realise I bought a lot of parts and really this was an insane build. Originally I had a parts list but eventually I went crazy and bought things I thought i might need. The RAM listed is 16gb as I swapped this into my old PC to get 32gb from it for this build. The CPU was from CEX because they owed me £205 on voucher for a defective GPU.

Hopefully this share works

Yes. I have the PWM fan header on the CPU fan header (I could have used the pump header but was told to use the CPU header. I'm not sure which is right). The power does indeed use a molex. As the Quadro uses a Molex I use 2 molex on the pump and Quadro and an adapter to adapt the third molex to power 2 sata drives. Who would have thought I'd still be using Molex!

I messed up 2 of the fans as I foolishly was blind and bought the 5V versions. 2 new 12V have arrived to install.

 

[Insanniti]

Yes. I have the PWM fan header on the CPU fan header (I could have used the pump header but was told to use the CPU header. I'm not sure which is right). The power does indeed use a molex. As the Quadro uses a Molex I use 2 molex on the pump and Quadro and an adapter to adapt the third molex to power 2 sata drives. Who would have thought I'd still be using Molex!

I messed up 2 of the fans as I foolishly was blind and bought the 5V versions. 2 new 12V have arrived to install.

Are you not using the Quadro to control the pump ?

I have a dual rad NCase build, with a quadro & set it up to use delta T (ambient / water) to control the fans and pump, runs extremely cool with a 3950x and Radeon VII both in the loop

 

[morj]

I have a dual rad NCase build, with a quadro & set it up to use delta T (ambient / water) to control the fans and pump, runs extremely cool with a 3950x and Radeon VII both in the loop

Have you tested how much does the pump speed actually matter? I had a single-rad system (with a chonky radiator) and ended up just setting the DDC pump to 55% on the Quadro because spinning it up under load would make the system louder, but not cooler.

 

[Insanniti]

Have you tested how much does the pump speed actually matter? I had a single-rad system (with a chonky radiator) and ended up just setting the DDC pump to 55% on the Quadro because spinning it up under load would make the system louder, but not cooler.

If using Delta Temp by creating a virtual sensor from Water - Ambient Temp sensors, then you no longer need to base your fan/pump speeds from the load or component heat. Instead you set your curves from the Delta Temp of the Water, ie as the load increases, the water gets warmer, and then you increase your fan curve/pump curves to remove this extra heat.

In my setup, I have a Aquasuite virtual sensor for Delta Temp, and then create a fan curve based on this from 0 to 5 degrees.
Pump power goes from 40% - 50% over this delta T range
Side & Bottom Rad Fans go from 55% - 70% over this delta T range

I have a few custom water cooled PC's, and fan speed increases over pump speed increase are more important as the delta Temp increases. Usually for fans I will keep the curve fairly auto over the range, for pump speed I usually keep it quite flat for the majority of the range, and then up to the max pump speed I want at the top of the range.

 

[morj]

If using Delta Temp by creating a virtual sensor from Water - Ambient Temp sensors, then you no longer need to base your fan/pump speeds from the load or component heat. Instead you set your curves from the Delta Temp of the Water, ie as the load increases, the water gets warmer, and then you increase your fan curve/pump curves to remove this extra heat.

In my setup, I have a Aquasuite virtual sensor for Delta Temp, and then create a fan curve based on this from 0 to 5 degrees.
Pump power goes from 40% - 50% over this delta T range
Side & Bottom Rad Fans go from 55% - 70% over this delta T range

I have a few custom water cooled PC's, and fan speed increases over pump speed increase are more important as the delta Temp increases. Usually for fans I will keep the curve fairly auto over the range, for pump speed I usually keep it quite flat for the majority of the range, and then up to the max pump speed I want at the top of the range.

Hey, nice tip about the deltas, I usually (currently on my second water-cooled rig) just base the fan speeds on water speeds in Aquasuite (my ambients are fairly stable), but I'll try this approach too, if the Quadro supports it. My point was if the pump provides enough flow while being quieter than the rest of the system at, say, 55%, the benefit of running the pump at full speed in case of "overheat" might be negligible. For the fan curve it's not the case, obviously.

 

[Insanniti]

Hey, nice tip about the deltas, I usually (currently on my second water-cooled rig) just base the fan speeds on water speeds in Aquasuite (my ambients are fairly stable), but I'll try this approach too, if the Quadro supports it. My point was if the pump provides enough flow while being quieter than the rest of the system at, say, 55%, the benefit of running the pump at full speed in case of "overheat" might be negligible. For the fan curve it's not the case, obviously.

Yeah exactly from my experience too. Increases in pump speed are not as effective after a given flow rate, compared to increases in Fan speed - for removing the additional heat.

Yeah the quadro supports the Delta T, you need to use virtual sensors in the playground of aquasuite. I can take some screen shots of my settings if you need.

 

[Infrabasse]

Hey guys,
Sorry to deviate, just dropping this here real quick.
From what I can tell the EK classic SE 240 fits while keeping the front I/O in place.
I meant to put this info here rather than the other thread.

Length clearance of the GPU, with the rad pushed all the way back, is a potential issue on longer cards though (I measure roughly 255mm)--> I think that should work with carefully selected RTX3xxx. Also probably possible to lengthen that clearance through weird and wonderful fittings contraption.
Thickness of 27mm will not leave a lot of space for the fans to breathe but it should at least fit.

I'm in the very early stages of the build so I can't bring a lot more details just yet, but I thought it was important to bring a bit more info on that front I/O situation.

 

[Danglos]

Sorry very late reply. I foolishly had 5V fans on the side and just installed the correct PWM 12V. I put my pump on CPU header because it has an alarm/safety setting so if pump dies I don't cook the PC. Currently waiting on sourcing a new GPU as my watercooled 2080 Super was too wide. I'm hoping for a 3080 FE as that looks nice and short but getting one has been impossible!

 

[wzhalex]

yeah, I wish I could get one in October. I think the water block for 3080 FE will also come out in mid-late October.

 

[PepeLePew]

Hey guys, quick question and hopefully someone can provide some direction... question is towards the bottom of this post.

So I got my new Case M1 v6.1 in January... finally I'm building pretty much the same build as Optimum Tech did in his video.

Moving from my existing AIO system to My First Custom Loop system in my new M1 case:

Old system
- i9900k
- Asus ROG Strix z390-i
- G.Skill Trident Z 16GB
- Cooler Master ML120L
- Cooler Master Elite 130
- Evo Plus 250
- Evo Plus 1TB
- 950 Evo 500
- Corsair SF450
- MSI RX 580 Armor 8gb OC

New System: Ncase M1
- i9900k, Asus ROG Strix z390-i
- G.Skill Trident Z 16GB
- Evo Plus 250, Evo Plus 1TB, 950 Evo 500
- *Corsair SF750 (finally, 2 months wait!)
- MSI RX 580 Armor 8gb OC

Custom Loop:
- EK-Momentum Z390-i CPU Block
- EK 3.2 DDC Pump
- IceMan Cooler Res.
- Koolance QDC3 x 2 sets
- Nvidia 3070 FE
- EK Vector 3070 FE GPU Block just released...
- All the fittings mostly EK, Alpha, & Koolance due to scarce availability in Canada & Pandemic - waiting in a few more.
- Noctua NF-A12x15 x 2 bottom RAD
- XSPC TX 240 Ultrathin
- Thermaltake Toughfan 12 x 2 (only because I - couldn't find the Noctua nf-a12x25, and these were black...) - Side RAD

I really want to have to most quiet system possible. So after reading EK's material on Rad sizes, YouTube Tech vids and full of threads and different opinions, I understand that a thicker RAD can be great, but fans must run higher to provide the proper cooling, this means fans running at higher RPMs and will a lot louder.

So I finally received the EK Coolstream PE 240 last week, but I'm on the fence!

Here's the question: Should I get the EK Coolstream SE 240 instead?

The fans would run lower RPMs, less noise, a bit more space in the case...and based on my understanding (maybe I'm wrong), I would get the the same cooling efficiency as the PE.

Or should I just stick with the PE?

One lat thing, I do potentially plan to OC the CPU to 4.7ghz on all cores (maybe push to 5ghz).

Thank you all in advance for your thoughts a d opinions!!

Be safe everyone!

Cheers!!

 

[alitech]

If using Delta Temp by creating a virtual sensor from Water - Ambient Temp sensors, then you no longer need to base your fan/pump speeds from the load or component heat. Instead you set your curves from the Delta Temp of the Water, ie as the load increases, the water gets warmer, and then you increase your fan curve/pump curves to remove this extra heat.

In my setup, I have a Aquasuite virtual sensor for Delta Temp, and then create a fan curve based on this from 0 to 5 degrees.
Pump power goes from 40% - 50% over this delta T range
Side & Bottom Rad Fans go from 55% - 70% over this delta T range

I have a few custom water cooled PC's, and fan speed increases over pump speed increase are more important as the delta Temp increases. Usually for fans I will keep the curve fairly auto over the range, for pump speed I usually keep it quite flat for the majority of the range, and then up to the max pump speed I want at the top of the range.

Hi @Insanniti

I am just about to build into my ncase M1. I want to pick your brains on the fan speeds please.

Asus x570 i gaming
Ryzen 3950x
Asus 1080ti Turbo with waterblock

I am going to put 2 rads in there. I have all the kit from Optimum tech videos.

As both rads will have 2 fans each, do I connect the fans to case fan heads or split all 4 from the CPU fan header? I want to manage the curves like you do and I have a aquacomputer water temp sensor.

I have just learned from this thread about this quadro fan control device. Would you do the fan curve seting from bios over this quadro device?

 

[alitech]

Guys, I too am on the journey and almost have everything. Getting my Ncase tomorrow yeehaw!

Here is the spec. Any advice for the build most welcome

New System: Ncase M1
- Ryzen 3950x
- G.Skill Trident Z 64GB 4000Mhz
- Trident 2TB PCIE-4
- *Corsair SF750
- Asus x570 i-gaming
- Asus 1080ti Turbo 11GB
- ADT M.2 riser for 10GB SFP+ Nic
- Mellanox 10GB SFP+ nic

Custom Loop:
- Alphacool Eisblock XPX CPU or EK-Supremacy EVO (whichever is better)
- EK 3.2 Elite DDC Pump
- IceMan Cooler Res.
- Alphacool quick disconnects x 2 sets
- Asus 1080ti waterblock by Byski
- EK Torque fittings + EK Matte black tubing 16mm/10mm
- EK Coolstreem 240mm 400mm thick main rad
- XSPC slim 240mm or HJ 17mm slim rad from Aliexpress (whichever one fits better with the 2nd PCI card)
- 3x Noctua NF-A12x25
- 1x Noctua NF-A12x15
- Alphacool water temp sensor to manage fan curves
- Koolance low profile 90 degree fittings if needed


Further upgrades down the line:
5 inch 1440p monitor for Aida64 dash on the front panel (will purchase a new front panel to cut into)

 

[PepeLePew]

Guys, I too am on the journey and almost have everything. Getting my Ncase tomorrow yeehaw!

Here is the spec. Any advice for the build most welcome

New System: Ncase M1
- Ryzen 3950x
- G.Skill Trident Z 64GB 4000Mhz
- Trident 2TB PCIE-4
- *Corsair SF750
- Asus x570 i-gaming
- Asus 1080ti Turbo 11GB
- ADT M.2 riser for 10GB SFP+ Nic
- Mellanox 10GB SFP+ nic

Custom Loop:
- Alphacool Eisblock XPX CPU or EK-Supremacy EVO (whichever is better)
- EK 3.2 Elite DDC Pump
- IceMan Cooler Res.
- Alphacool quick disconnects x 2 sets
- Asus 1080ti waterblock by Byski
- EK Torque fittings + EK Matte black tubing 16mm/10mm
- EK Coolstreem 240mm 400mm thick main rad
- XSPC slim 240mm or HJ 17mm slim rad from Aliexpress (whichever one fits better with the 2nd PCI card)
- 3x Noctua NF-A12x25
- 1x Noctua NF-A12x15
- Alphacool water temp sensor to manage fan curves
- Koolance low profile 90 degree fittings if needed


Further upgrades down the line:
5 inch 1440p monitor for Aida64 dash on the front panel (will purchase a new front panel to cut into)

Looking forward to seeing pics of your build.