Completed The MI-6 Microtower Case: Performance in 6.7L

[Revenant]

This is interesting, may I know which Adobe software exactly? I assume something like their movie editor? (which I am not really familiar with)

Adobe Premier Pro.

Previously I had to stick to Intel due to Quicksync support. Now, I can just use the GPU. I did some preliminary benchmarks and found that I didn't need Quicksync anymore. Truth be told, I'm just happy to be rid of the 8700. That CPU needed a delid to get decent thermals, and I wasn't about to delid it.

 

[Revenant]

....and Amazon lost my B550 mainboard and SSD. Luckily they're sending another.

I went with the MSI B550. I put the Asus X570 in the wife's rig, but the little fans are audible and annoying. The B550 fan can be disabled. Also, it has good compatibility with the Noctua L12-S. What if the L12-S can't handle the stock 5950X? Well...I have a plan for that too. You see I don't own just one MI-6. I own two, and the other one has the 120mm AIO loft.

 

[ignsvn]

....and Amazon lost my B550 mainboard and SSD. Luckily they're sending another.

I went with the MSI B550. I put the Asus X570 in the wife's rig, but the little fans are audible and annoying. The B550 fan can be disabled. Also, it has good compatibility with the Noctua L12-S. What if the L12-S can't handle the stock 5950X? Well...I have a plan for that too. You see I don't own just one MI-6. I own two, and the other one has the 120mm AIO loft.

Not that I will need one, but I look forward to see how L12 handles the 5950X

 

[Revenant]

Not that I will need one, but I look forward to see how L12 handles the 5950X

The board comes in today. It should be a relatively easy swap so, providing I can get it done, I will at least have some basic numbers tonight. Of course I have to capture footage as I do the swap, and that's the most time consuming issue.

 

[Revenant]

Time to get started








Edit: For those wondering, I'll be re-using my DDR4-3200 (for now), GTX 1070 (for obvious reasons), Corsair PSU, and Noctua L12S. While I was tempted to move the whole thing into my white and black MI-6, I just....just...really don't want to do that much rewiring.

 

[eggDK]

Hi Revenant. Just for reference; I recently upgraded my MI-6 build to 5600X with NH-L12S. I'll share some of my experiences:

• After making full PBO curve optimization I am getting ~4.55GHz all core (during Prime95 all-core load).
• I am still trying to decide if AutoOC offset is worth it. So far I've concluded that it shouldn't be more than +50Mhz. It doesn't give any performance, but does cause crashes in all-core load.
• 5600X is 12 thread, and I made the Curve Optimization per core, which I greatly recommend for performance! (however it will take even more time with your 5950X )
• I used Prime95 to see which core fails, and then reduced the offset for said core until all cores were stable (hope it makes sense..)
• I've tried to optimize PPT/TDC/EDC, so that they don't limit the CPU, but are also not astronomical. (i.e. Ryzen Master shows PPT/TDC/EDC all at ~80% to ~90% during Prime95 load)
• Max load temp with this setup is ~84degC, when ambient is around 21degC
• BTW, I can't recommend flipping the fan on NH-L12S, as this resulted in temp increase up to 88degC.

I look forward to seeing your progress, and maybe be inspired to upgrade to 5950X

BTW, did your cooler also need to be squeezed by the side panel like this?

 

[Revenant]

Good info and thank you. I plan to work on it today.

The L12S is squeezed just a bit even with the 8700. But, well worth it.

 

[Revenant]

Well, I got everything installed. Seemed fine but then the BIOS reset. I have to dig up a PCIE 4.0 cable to reset it again. I refuse to pull the mainboard again.

edit: I ordered the same one that’s included with the Ghost S1.

Edit 2: I really hate this MSI board. If it weren’t for the fitment issues with the L12S, I would happily use something else.

 

[ignsvn]

Why don't you all use other coolers instead of L12S (which is too tall anw)?

There are others like.. Thermalright XP90, or the older L12 (non S), or Shuriken something (I forgot the exact model number) etc?

 

[Revenant]

Why don't you all use other coolers instead of L12S (which is too tall anw)?

There are others like.. Thermalright XP90, or the older L12 (non S), or Shuriken something (I forgot the exact model number) etc?

L12S fits the case perfectly. It also provides the best performance.

 

[ignsvn]

L12S fits the case perfectly. It also provides the best performance.

I never doubt its performance, but I remember it's 70mm tall while MI-6 clearance is 68mm. I believe by default it won't fit unless there's little push here & there, and/or manufacturing tolerance.

 

[Revenant]

I never doubt its performance, but I remember it's 70mm tall while MI-6 clearance is 68mm. I believe by default it won't fit unless there's little push here & there, and/or manufacturing tolerance.

There was a little tolerance left in. I don’t recall which post it was, but way back in the beginning it was mentioned.

 

[Revenant]

Ok. Got it working. Thank you MSI for that BIOS nightmare...

Right now I’m doing some preliminary testing before I put the side panels back on. It looks like PBO is going to have to be limited to 125 to 135 watts though. Cone bench hd sitting at 82c at 3.6ghz all core right now.

more to follow...

 

[Revenant]

A bit more testing later: I can easily hit 10500 in R20 but the fans spin up and the system gets buzzy. So I pulled the throttle back from 145 watts to 125. All core load slows down to about 9100-9250 in Cinebench R20, and single score comes in at 609. All core is at 3.6ghz while single core is at 4.8ghz, and sometimes hits a full 5GHZ.

Temps are at 70c for single core, and 80c for multi core. 145 watt temps were at 87C all core.

The system is basically silent.

So where does this leave me? Basically the speed of a fully clock 3950X on a 280mm AIO....Except I’m getting it on a virtually silent 6.7L computer use a Noctua L12S.

Small, quiet, and fast? Did I hit the trifecta?

So it seems that to run the 5950X in our tiny little case, you are going to sacrifice 10% to 15% of its performance in multi core, if you want it to be quiet. Single core is still ripping fast

Honestly, I didn’t expect this to work as well as it did, and thought I would be ordering a 120mm AIO for the loft by now.

More to come as I tune and finish this build off.

 

[ignsvn]

A bit more testing later: I can easily hit 10500 in R20 but the fans spin up and the system gets buzzy. So I pulled the throttle back from 145 watts to 125. All core load slows down to about 9100-9250 in Cinebench R20, and single score comes in at 609. All core is at 3.6ghz while single core is at 4.8ghz, and sometimes hits a full 5GHZ.

Temps are at 70c for single core, and 80c for multi core. 145 watt temps were at 87C all core.

The system is basically silent.

So where does this leave me? Basically the speed of a fully clock 3950X on a 280mm AIO....Except I’m getting it on a virtually silent 6.7L computer use a Noctua L12S.

Small, quiet, and fast? Did I hit the trifecta?

So it seems that to run the 5950X in our tiny little case, you are going to sacrifice 10% to 15% of its performance in multi core, if you want it to be quiet. Single core is still ripping fast

Honestly, I didn’t expect this to work as well as it did, and thought I would be ordering a 120mm AIO for the loft by now.

More to come as I tune and finish this build off.

That's impressive. If noise is not a concern, can I say that you can easily reach full performance (without 10-15% sacrifice)?

Anw, now go slap a 3060 or a 2070, and go for the PPL contest!

 

[rfarmer]

That's impressive. If noise is not a concern, can I say that you can easily reach full performance (without 10-15% sacrifice)?

Anw, now go slap a 3060 or a 2070, and go for the PPL contest!

If @Revenant could manage to get a hold of a 3060Ti Aero itx this thing would be a complete monster, I have a feeling it will be next to impossible to buy one though.

 

[Revenant]

@ignsv: If noise isn't an issue, I think you could reach the full stock performance. Typically in reviews that was about 10500 give or take a few in R20.

@rfarmer: You have no idea how much I want a 3060ti Aero right now.... It hurts... I might go so far as to buy one of the MSI SFF Trident series and strip one out if this keeps up.


So I followed the Optimum Tech guide to undervolting the 5950X and got a good result. Blender R20 is now in the 9500 range, up from 9100-9200 range. Temps are way down at 60 to 70C. CPU speed on all core load is 3.7GHZ. Single core load is 4.8ghz to 5ghz.

The only issue I have is that Prime95 is still sitting at 2.6ghz, but is stable.

SPECS so far:

5950X w/L12S
32GB Corsair DDR-3200 CAS 16
MSI B550 Gaming ITX WiFi mainboard
Corsair 600 Watt gold SFX PSU
1TB Samsung 980 Pro
2TB Samsung 970 EVO
2TB Seagate Firecuda Gaming SSHD
GTX 1070 MSI Aero ITX


EDIT: I'm now closing in on 10K for Cinebench R20. Early gaming tests show 4.6 to 4.8GHZ on active cores for Battlefield 1. Battlefield 5 was a little less, but is more multi-threaded. I'm getting some odd GPU behavior in Battlefield 5 though. Gaming temps are actually higher than Cinebench, and are pushing mid 80s C.

 

[ignsvn]

@rfarmer: You have no idea how much I want a 3060ti Aero right now.... It hurts... I might go so far as to buy one of the MSI SFF Trident series and strip one out if this keeps up.

Get the trident, switch the original GPU with a less powerful GPU (which is supposedly easier to find).

Then sell the Trident again for a lower price stating that it's a Trident with downgraded GPU, but cooler & silent

 

[Revenant]

Get the trident, switch the original GPU with a less powerful GPU (which is supposedly easier to find).

Then sell the Trident again for a lower price stating that it's a Trident with downgraded GPU, but cooler & silent

You know I'll just end up keeping both.... Plus I want to use the 1070 in a Custom Mod 3.27L that's been sitting in my storage closet for a couple years now. GTX 1070 + 5600X with an L9A.

So here's an interesting thing; Games are casuing more CPU heat right now than Cinebench or Prime95. The CPU seems to behave more like a GPU in terms of self-regulation. I put a max temp of 85C into the Bios, which is 5 under the rated max cpu temp. The CPU will run itself right up to that 85C in say Battlefield 5, and maintain good clocks.

This is while only pulling 85 watts so it's clearly only a few cores active. I buttoned up the side panels. I can say that if you have the air cooling tophat, you should probably use it. Case gets hot, but the interior temps are good.

Ok...realistically, you really want to stick to the 5600X if you're going to air cool with the L12S. Maybe the 5800X. But, you certainly can make the 5950X work if you try. Productivity work will top out at the same performance as a 3950X on a 280mm AIO, while gaming will be faster. Not bad at all for such a tiny box. Not for the inexperienced, though it was easier than trying to get my old I7-8700 to do 4.3GHZ all core.

I'm going to keep playing with it a bit more and see what happens.

Idle and mild cpu load stay very, very quiet. Idle is actually quieter than my ATX rig with a full Noctua Redux 140mm setup. Full CPU load, and full gpu load though do get loud. Not enough to be heard over my headphones though. Certainly less than my PS5 spinning it's BD up.

I'll post a full video at some point.


...okay, I'm off to go shove a 7820X into a Cerberus X case, and overclock it 4.5GHZ all core. With another dumb MSI motherboard....


EDIT: Here are my settings right now.

L12S at 100% fan speed when at 80C and 40% fan speed when below 60C (almost inaudible)
Bottom intake fan at 40%
PBO on Advanced
Negative 10 power offset in PBO
+200 frequency in PBO
125 Watt total power draw cap.
XMP Profile 1
CPU Throttle point lowered to 85C from 90C
Windows Power Setting at Balanced per AMD spec. The Ryzen Profile is not available for this CPU per AMD.

GPU is a MSI Aero ITX 1070 with +150 core and +200 memory at 105% power

Effective speeds:

CPU: 2.7GHZ All Core under Prime95 hottest mode

3.6 to 3.7 GHZ All core under Cinebench

4.8 to 5GHZ Single core Cinebench

4.5 to 4.7GHZ during gaming

Single core short term bursts have been as high as 5.1GHZ during regular usage.


GPU: 1.85 to 2.05 GHZ for GPU


Temps (Note: 72F room temp)

Cinebench All Core at 125 Watts cap; 73 to 75C (Fan barely audible and at about 75%) / 3.6 to 3.7 GHZ.

Cinebench Single core: 77 to 80C drawing 63 Watts at first, and settled to 73C with fan at 1300RPM 4.6 to 4.8 GHZ

Battlefield 1: CPU was at 78 to 81C the entire game on 64 Player server. 4.5 to 4.8GHZ

Battlefield 5: 85C the entire time which is my manually set throttle point. 4.55 GHZ

 

[eggDK]

@Revenant : I don't want to come off as a wise-ass But you have to do per-core curve optimization. There's a huge difference between how much undervolt each core can handle. My cores are at -21, -28, -28, -1, -28, -28.. So you see if I went all-core I might be limited to -1, because of one hungry core. All things said, you may gain a lot of those last 10-15% back (I think).

/eggDK