Looking for help with first SFF Gaming Build (actually, first build ever)

[cijanzen]

Hey everyone,

I'm new here but have been following your forums for a while checking out builds and getting inspiration. I'm looking to build a gaming rig with performance and noise as the two main factors with budget coming in third.

I've put together a build on PCPP and would love to get some feedback on what I've got so far.

I'd like to have as quiet as possible of a system while still having good performance for at least 1080p gaming with 40-60FPS with max/high settings. Game examples being: Witcher series, Tomb Raider.

The only reason I'm thinking of the K processor is because I can use Intel Retail Edge to get a good deal on one (assuming good holiday discount is offered). I don't think I'd overclock too much at least not initially but perhaps in year 2-3 of use.

I like the RVZ02 and I'm pretty confident in this choice above others. I think I want an optical drive so Node is out.

I've read good reviews for the MSI 1060 Gaming X as it's low power and relatively quiet but If anyone has suggestions definitely chime in.

I was thinking either the Gigabyte Gaming 5 or the Asus Pro Gaming for motherboard but Asus reviews seem mixed and the Gigabyte is a bit cheaper. If I don't go with a K processor is there any sense in getting a Z170 board? In terms of the future do you think I'd be able to keep a Z board for more than 1 generation?

I'm really unsure about whether to get an m.2 or 2.5" SSD. I would be getting a SATA model either way and was thinking the EVO850 but I'm open to suggestions if there's a cheaper drive with decent performance. My concern with the m.2 is heat due to sharing the same space as the GPU in the case. Will this be a problem? I like the idea of m.2 for fewer cables.

The last thing I'm not certain about is whether to get 450W or 600W from Corsair. AFAIK they are the best PSU's for my build in regards to noise and quality but I'm not sure which one will provide the best long term use and silence. If I upgrade my GPU down the road it may require more power so I don't know whether I should just get the 600W up front. The 450W seems to be quieter from most reviews but the 600W would require less overall power in my current setup that I propose.

Lastly, if anyone has experience with Gigabyte Gaming 5 mobo and the Big Shuriken 2, did you have any issues with the USB header? I've heard that the low profile of the cooler causes a few issues.

I'm very excited to start buying and building this rig but I hope that you can help me feel confident or suggest other options before I do!

Here's the part list:
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i5-6600K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor ($304.75 @ Vuugo)
CPU Cooler: Scythe BIG Shuriken 2 Rev. B 45.5 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler ($69.05)
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-Z170N-Gaming 5 Mini ITX LGA1151 Motherboard ($193.75 @ Vuugo)
Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws V Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-2400 Memory ($89.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Storage: Samsung 850 EVO 500GB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive ($213.46 @ DirectCanada)
Video Card: MSI GeForce GTX 1060 6GB GAMING X Video Card ($399.98 @ DirectCanada)
Case: Silverstone RVZ02B HTPC Case ($87.55 @ DirectCanada)
Power Supply: Corsair SF 600W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular SFX Power Supply ($138.62 @ DirectCanada)
Optical Drive: LG GS40N DVD/CD Writer ($44.99 @ Memory Express)
Other: StarTech 6-Inch Slimline SATA to SATA Female/Male Adapter with Power ($9.00)
Total: $1551.14
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2016-09-25 16:29 EDT-0400

 

[jtd871]

For this build and no OC, the SF450 should handle it.

Are you at all interested in OC the CPU or GPU?

If you don't want to OC the CPU, you may want to consider a H170 mobo to trim costs.

I'd double-check compatibility with the CPU cooler. Not saying the Big Shuriken won't work, but Silverstone has developed the Argon coolers for their SFF cases.

Unless you're reading or burning lots of discs, consider a USB DVD drive and skip the thin ODD.

 

[Gautam]

Are you sure the Big Shuriken will fit with that RAM? I can't say I've used either personally, but it's something you might want to double-check if you haven't already.

Your system as it is will probably never even draw 300W, much less anywhere near 600.

 

[cijanzen]

For this build and no OC, the SF450 should handle it.

Are you at all interested in OC the CPU or GPU?

If you don't want to OC the CPU, you may want to consider a H170 mobo to trim costs.

I'd double-check compatibility with the CPU cooler. Not saying the Big Shuriken won't work, but Silverstone has developed the Argon coolers for their SFF cases.

Unless you're reading or burning lots of discs, consider a USB DVD drive and skip the thin ODD.

I think I'd try to OC both the GPU and CPU a little bit but after a year or two might try to overclock the CPU a little further.

With some overclocking in mind and potential upgrades down the road would you still suggest 450W?

I'll check out the H170 depending on the CPU sale for sure and I might skip the optical drive as I remembered that I have an old Lacie drive I could hook up when needed.

Are you sure the Big Shuriken will fit with that RAM? I can't say I've used either personally, but it's something you might want to double-check if you haven't already.

Your system as it is will probably never even draw 300W, much less anywhere near 600.

As far as I can tell the cooler has worked with those particular parts in other builds I've seen. My concern with the AR06 would be that in reviews it was louder and hotter than the Big Shuriken 2. The AR06 is easier for me to get and cheaper but do you think it would work well enough with an overclocked CPU and still be somewhat quiet?

 

[Gautam]

The Shuriken is a superior cooler. It has two more heatpipes, a larger radiator, and is designed to be used with larger fans. You can replace fans, play with speed profiles, and so on. But the bigger the fan, the quieter it is for the same airflow, and the better the heatsink is, the slower you can run a fan. Make certain the Shuriken fits, and go with it if it does.

The PSU is no issue at all. I'm running a 6700K and GTX 1070 off a 400W PSU, and with them both overclocked they barely draw over 300W from the wall in an absolute worst case scenario. The CPU is rated for 95W, and the GPU 120W. A 450W PSU can handle them comfortably.

I'm going to warn you again about the RAM. It might be possible to rotate the heatsink etc to clear the RAM, but I'm not sure. Make certain you are. There are low profile kits, like the Crucial Ballistix Sport, and Corsair Vengeance readily available as well.

http://www.eteknix.com/scythe-big-shuriken-2-rev-b-low-profile-cpu-cooler-review/4/
"RAM clearance is obstructed in the first slot so you will need lower profile RAM. On mini-ITX motherboards this will block RAM slots #1 and #2 so you will need low profile RAM all round."

FWIW I have the ASUS 170I Pro Gaming and have no issues with it, but the Gigabyte looks like a good board as well.

The tl;dr is be as sure as you can be that everything you've picked fits. There can be unpleasant surprises with small cases.

 

[MarcParis]

Definitely SF600, as one day, you could put another GPU or CPU in this RVZ02 case..
As RAM, please go for corsair vengeance lpx for low profile..

For SSD, try to take pcie SSD like new intel 600p, quite good rate performance/price...or wait for samsung 960

 

[BirdofPrey]

The lower wattage should be fine. Even the highest performing cards nowadays can be comfortably run off a PSU in the 4-500 Watt range.
As for future upgradability, Kaby Lake, coming next year uses the same socket as Skylake does, so you should be able to upgrade your CPU to that at least. No word yet on what sockets future processors will use, but the way CPUs have been progressing recently, you shouldn't really think about upgrading the CPU, and should focus more on whether or not the chipset is outdated.

As for SSDs, the cost of the cheaper M.2s are starting to come in line with 2.5", so you might as well go M.2 for lower capacities (the higher capacities in M.2 have a bit of a premium since they need to use fewer, higher capacity chips, where 2.5 inch can use more, cheaper chips). For the SSD you mentioned, heat shouldn't be too bad. All SSDs generate some heat, and too much heat from the CPU could cause problems, of course, but it's really only the latest and fastest SSDs that are actually generating enough heat to throttle by large amounts.

 

[MarcParis]

héhé I can't argue, it's just my point of view...When I buy a component, I'm always sure that these components will be used in another way than expected..
Last example : my original S4 mini setup (6700K undervolted, z170n gaming 5, 16gb DDR4 corsair lpx@3200, ssd 950pro, R9 Nano, SF600) is now moved to my bitfenix phenom and will becomme backbone on my next gaming setup (AMD vega)..

In the past, I lost some money not choosing best cpu at the moment, for a too much dedicated setup (ie core i5 2500k instead of 2600k, 3770S instead of 3770K, etc..)

It's my business model..

ps : please note that on Gigabyte z170n gaming 5, it's useless to enable FAST boot mode with a pcie ssd...in fact, it's a loss of time...lol..as bios is not loading pcie drives...only sata ones.. anyway, even without fast boot mode, bios is starting very quickly..

 

[cijanzen]

The Shuriken is a superior cooler. It has two more heatpipes, a larger radiator, and is designed to be used with larger fans. You can replace fans, play with speed profiles, and so on. But the bigger the fan, the quieter it is for the same airflow, and the better the heatsink is, the slower you can run a fan. Make certain the Shuriken fits, and go with it if it does.

The PSU is no issue at all. I'm running a 6700K and GTX 1070 off a 400W PSU, and with them both overclocked they barely draw over 300W from the wall in an absolute worst case scenario. The CPU is rated for 95W, and the GPU 120W. A 450W PSU can handle them comfortably.

I'm going to warn you again about the RAM. It might be possible to rotate the heatsink etc to clear the RAM, but I'm not sure. Make certain you are. There are low profile kits, like the Crucial Ballistix Sport, and Corsair Vengeance readily available as well.

http://www.eteknix.com/scythe-big-shuriken-2-rev-b-low-profile-cpu-cooler-review/4/
"RAM clearance is obstructed in the first slot so you will need lower profile RAM. On mini-ITX motherboards this will block RAM slots #1 and #2 so you will need low profile RAM all round."

FWIW I have the ASUS 170I Pro Gaming and have no issues with it, but the Gigabyte looks like a good board as well.

The tl;dr is be as sure as you can be that everything you've picked fits. There can be unpleasant surprises with small cases.

I'll switch over to the Corsair LPX memory based on your feedback. Looking back, it does appear that more builds are using this than the Ripsaw anyways. Thanks for the heads up.

Do you use the wifi on the Asus motherboard? The reviews I've read seem to imply that it doesn't work but that it may have been fixed in a more recent update. It does appear that some SATA ports are blocked on the Gigabyte board in Raven cases so maybe I'll switch to the Asus but I have to do more research on that.

Definitely SF600, as one day, you could put another GPU or CPU in this RVZ02 case..
As RAM, please go for corsair vengeance lpx for low profile..

For SSD, try to take pcie SSD like new intel 600p, quite good rate performance/price...or wait for samsung 960

Of course you have to go and contradict everyone! I appreciate your thoughts on the PSU and I guess depending on which parts I end up with I'll just have to go with my gut. The 600 does give room for future growth and certainly wouldn't be stressed now.

The lower wattage should be fine. Even the highest performing cards nowadays can be comfortably run off a PSU in the 4-500 Watt range.
As for future upgradability, Kaby Lake, coming next year uses the same socket as Skylake does, so you should be able to upgrade your CPU to that at least. No word yet on what sockets future processors will use, but the way CPUs have been progressing recently, you shouldn't really think about upgrading the CPU, and should focus more on whether or not the chipset is outdated.

As for SSDs, the cost of the cheaper M.2s are starting to come in line with 2.5", so you might as well go M.2 for lower capacities (the higher capacities in M.2 have a bit of a premium since they need to use fewer, higher capacity chips, where 2.5 inch can use more, cheaper chips). For the SSD you mentioned, heat shouldn't be too bad. All SSDs generate some heat, and too much heat from the CPU could cause problems, of course, but it's really only the latest and fastest SSDs that are actually generating enough heat to throttle by large amounts.

I think if I get an unlocked processor now I should be good for quite some time so I'll try to stick with that. Thanks for your input regarding the m.2. I think I'll probably stick with that unless I find something at a much better price point.

héhé I can't argue, it's just my point of view...When I buy a component, I'm always sure that these components will be used in another way than expected..
Last example : my original S4 mini setup (6700K undervolted, z170n gaming 5, 16gb DDR4 corsair lpx@3200, ssd 950pro, R9 Nano, SF600) is now moved to my bitfenix phenom and will becomme backbone on my next gaming setup (AMD vega)..

In the past, I lost some money not choosing best cpu at the moment, for a too much dedicated setup (ie core i5 2500k instead of 2600k, 3770S instead of 3770K, etc..)

It's my business model..

ps : please note that on Gigabyte z170n gaming 5, it's useless to enable FAST boot mode with a pcie ssd...in fact, it's a loss of time...lol..as bios is not loading pcie drives...only sata ones.. anyway, even without fast boot mode, bios is starting very quickly..

Thanks again for your suggestions here, what cooler did/do you use on the Gigabyte motherboard and what case was it in at the time? Did you have any trouble with the USB header on there and/or blocked SATA ports? Thanks for the heads up on the FAST boot mode.

Any other thoughts on Gigabyte vs Asus? I've always liked Asus branding more but that's just fluff. I've just read many negative reviews about the Asus board and mainly positive about Gigabyte but there are definitely some short comings with the Gigabyte especially in the case I plan to use.

 

[MarcParis]

Me too I was long to decide between asus pro gaming Z170 or Gigabyte z170n gaming 5...and my conclusion on SFF was clearly Gigabyte Z170n gaming 5 due to large empty space near cpu (absolute no constraint on cpu cooler choice), less heatsinks that are blocking airflow of short cpu cooler

 

[cijanzen]

Me too I was long to decide between asus pro gaming Z170 or Gigabyte z170n gaming 5...and my conclusion on SFF was clearly Gigabyte Z170n gaming 5 due to large empty space near cpu (absolute no constraint on cpu cooler choice), less heatsinks that are blocking airflow of short cpu cooler

How did you deal with the USB header and the cooler? Did you have any issues with right angle Sata ports?

 

[Gautam]

Do you use the wifi on the Asus motherboard? The reviews I've read seem to imply that it doesn't work but that it may have been fixed in a more recent update.

I use wifi frequently, and it has never given me problems. You have to have the antenna connected, but the same is the case for pretty much any board. I usually pick ASUS over Gigabyte when given a choice as a personal preference. I know plenty of others who are the opposite. This time around, though, I gave Gigabyte a chance in the form of the Z170N-WIFI, and it was a terrible experience. I went through two of them, and they were both problematic. So I didn't even consider the Gaming 5. The Z170I Pro Gaming has been great so far. One strength of it which is important to me but not to most is that it has 6 USB 3.0 ports, and USB 3.0 ports are critical for virtual reality headsets and their peripherals. It also has two case fan headers rather the single one of the Gigabyte, but that's irrelevant for you. It has less space around the CPU socket, but that's because it has better cooling for the power management.

It's really never a mistake to get a better power supply, unless it causes space or price concerns. But the system you have spec'ed is just very far below the territory of 600W. There are people running similar ones (rather perilously) off of 250W...

 

[MarcParis]

How did you deal with the USB header and the cooler? Did you have any issues with right angle Sata ports?

well...I'm using only M.2 pci port right now. You also have 2 sata vertical usable even in SFF.
Even now, I've put my MB in a bitfenix Phenom where I have plenty of space

 

[Jury-Pool-Reject]

For some other options, you could read my post concerning my first Mini-ITX build...