Power Supply Options for S4M Build

[matogl0396]

Hi all,

Been reading extensively for days and still a little confused. Just want to make sure I fully understand my options before purchasing power supplies for my new S4M.

My Situation
Initial S4M build will include an i3-8100, 1060 6gb, Gechic 1303i (USB-powered monitor), USB wifi/bluetooth adapter, and bluetooth keyboard/mouse.

Separately, I have an NCASE M1 build with an i7-6800k (120w) and Zotac 1080 Ti Mini in it. My plan is to eventually replace those parts in the M1 and "retire" them to the S4M, possibly late this year or sometime next.

My Goal
I need to choose the best power options for my S4M, while trying to future-proof by purchasing items that can contribute to a higher-power setup down the road. Bonus points if I can go brickless with my 1060. Double bonus if I can leave room for one of those custom 2d bezels with front-facing USB cutouts...

My Options & Questions

Brick 1060: The most basic setup, HDPLEX 400w + Dell 330w external brick (temporary). Plan to upgrade to the Eurocom 780 in future (or hopefully a more reasonable alternative that may come along between now and then ).



Brickless 1060: This is where I'm more confused and would appreciate your guidance. I have 2 ideas:

*"Orangulan" -- This seems to have started with a popular S4M-C mod. HDPLEX 160w AC-DC + Dynamo Mini would power a 1060 for now (although I'm a little worried it would be a close fit with the peripheral devices I mentioned above).

Question #1: Would it fit if I swap the HDPLEX 400w for the Dynamo Mini in this scenario (it seems the AC-DC and DC-ATX are mounted in separate places anyway)?
Question #2: Would this block potential front-facing USB (I think so per 2d bezel page on NFC website)? Is there any NON-direct-plug solution that WOULD work with that cutout?
Question #3: Is it correct that the C8 connector screws into the new S4M, but the wiring will require some soldering? Also, the connector is sold out on NFC website, is it bundled with the new chassis, or do I need to buy it separately somewhere else?

My thought here is the HDPLEX 160w AC-DC gives me a temporary brickless solution, and the HDPLEX 400w can be kept to work with a Eurocom 780 (or alternative) in future.


*"Dynamo Duo" -- I see this combination mentioned in a few locations, but I'm not clear on the details. Sorry I tried to post links to my references, but apparently I haven't been a member long enough to do that. I found forum posts from both KMPKT and NFC Josh, as well as Josh's S4M logistics video on Youtube...

Question #1: I *think* the idea is to have 2 separate pairings:

1. DC-DC -> 360/400w DC-ATX -> GPU (external brick), and separately...
2. AC-DC -> 160w direct-plug DC-ATX -> all other components (uses C8 connector).

So we only have 1 external brick, but 2 wires that will be plugged in externally. Is this correct? Is the AC-DC piece really required (that isn't stated explicitly in the NFC links)? Is it fair to assume the Dynamo 360w DC-ATX and HDPLEX 400w could be used interchangeably in this scenario?

Question #2: Are there any good links to detailed builds, guides, etc. that I could reference to understand this combo better (especially with the Zotac 1080 Ti Mini, which I assume would be a primary target for this build)?

If the AC-DC is indeed required, then I could still start with the HDPLEX 400w + 160w AC-DC now (same plan as above). In a year or 2 I could actually choose between going whatever massive external brick exists at that time, *or* using this hybrid "Dynamo Duo" approach.



Hopefully this all made sense, but definitely let me know if any more info is required. Thanks so much in advance for your help.

Matt

 

[Kmpkt]

Hey Matt,

I'll try to answer your questions as best I can:

Question #1: Would it fit if I swap the HDPLEX 400w for the Dynamo Mini in this scenario (it seems the AC-DC and DC-ATX are mounted in separate places anyway)?

The Dynamo Mini/HDPlex 160W DC-ATX will fit just fine in the S4M and shouldn't block you from using your USB ports. It will run completely fine with the CPU in question and a 3GB 1060. Depending on the height of the GTX 1060 you've chosen, there are dedicated mounting points for the HDPlex 160W AC-DC on the bottom of the case so you can do a VERY tidy brick less build.

If you want future upgradability with the 1080 or 1080ti Mini, you can add a Dynamo 360 in the bottom of the case in place of the HDPlex 160W AC-DC and move to an external brick solution. There should be ample space for the Dynamo 360 under the Zotac 1080 Mini as I've fit checked it with the Gigabyte 1080 Mini which is 6mm taller and it just fits. The HDPlex has 12V outputs only which makes it incompatible in this scenario. You could however pull out your Dynamo Mini/HDPlex 160W DC-ATX unit and simply use the HDPlex 400W as a standalone. The upside of having the Dynamo Duo at this point instead of the HDPlex 400W DC-ATX is it has a combined rating of 520W which may enable a beefier build or alternatively more overclocking headroom (as the Eurocom 780 has TONS of room left to run in your scenario).

Question #2: Would this block potential front-facing USB (I think so per 2d bezel page on NFC website)? Is there any NON-direct-plug solution that WOULD work with that cutout?

I don't believe so

Question #3: Is it correct that the C8 connector screws into the new S4M, but the wiring will require some soldering? Also, the connector is sold out on NFC website, is it bundled with the new chassis, or do I need to buy it separately somewhere else?

You will have to get the C8 connector aftermarket and solder it yourself. I am pretty sure you could buy it pre-done from @Josh | NFC if you ask nicely.

Question #1: I *think* the idea is to have 2 separate pairings:

1. DC-DC -> 360/400w DC-ATX -> GPU (external brick), and separately...
2. AC-DC -> 160w direct-plug DC-ATX -> all other components (uses C8 connector).

So we only have 1 external brick, but 2 wires that will be plugged in externally. Is this correct? Is the AC-DC piece really required (that isn't stated explicitly in the NFC links)? Is it fair to assume the Dynamo 360w DC-ATX and HDPLEX 400w could be used interchangeably in this scenario?

This is not quite correct. The unique feature of the Dynamo system as I've designed it is that the Dynamo 360 has a passthrough function. What this means is that you can take a 16-24V input, pass it through to a second device such as the Dynamo Mini, an Intel NuC or an AsRock Mini STX board and still have 12V power for PCIe and SATA etc. at the other end of the board. It is by way of this function that you can use one brick to power both units. It ends up looking like this:

AC-DC Power Supply > Dynamo 360 > Dynamo Mini

The issue with the HDPlex 400W DC-ATX in this scenario is that it doesn't provide a 16-24V throughput to enable this functionality.

Question #2: Are there any good links to detailed builds, guides, etc. that I could reference to understand this combo better (especially with the Zotac 1080 Ti Mini, which I assume would be a primary target for this build)?

I am probably a week away to publishing a full set of instructions etc. with the help of the wonderful @QinX. I understand this is not the most intuitive system, but once you understand it I believe it to be elegant and tremendously functional. Keep an eye on my KMPKT subform here for more details.

 

[matogl0396]

Hey Matt,
I'll try to answer your questions as best I can:

Thanks so much for your detailed reply, this definitely improves my understanding, especially regarding the "Dynamo Duo".

FYI my card is the Gigabyte 1060 6GB Mini, and I think it is the same size as the 1080 Mini you mentioned in your post: (Tried to link but still not enough posts! The size is 169 x 131 x 37 mm.)

So it sounds like the HDPLEX 400w is off the table for me for a couple reasons. Instead, I can start with the HDPLEX 160w AC-DC + Dynamo Mini ("brickless"), then when I want to swap in a higher TDP videocard, I can replace the AC-DC unit with the Dynamo 360w DC-ATX and buy a big time external brick ("Dynamo Duo").

Based on your statements, sounds like the "brickless" parts will all fit and have sufficient power: HDPLEX 160w AC-DC + Dynamo Mini + Gigabyte 1060 6GB Mini. Does that sound correct?

Thank you again, and I'll definitely keep an eye out for your detailed instructions coming out soon!

 

[Kmpkt]

Seeing as your GPU is more than 111.15mm tall, you will need to mount the AC-DC unit on the front inside of the case next to the GPU using some sort of robust double sided adhesive. If it were 111.15mm or less then you could simply screw it into the provided holes on the bottom interior of the S4M.

The HDPlex 400W AC-DC may fit on the bottom of the case under your GPU, but I don't have exact measurements on the unit's height. Based on napkin math you have about 25mm of height to play with on this.

 

[matogl0396]

Seeing as your GPU is more than 111.15mm tall, you will need to mount the AC-DC unit on the front inside of the case next to the GPU using some sort of robust double sided adhesive. If it were 111.15mm or less then you could simply screw it into the provided holes on the bottom interior of the S4M.

Thanks, I think this is finally starting to click for me. It helped me to look at your picture here (I can finally post links ): . I know this is an S4M-C but it is still representative for my purposes.

So some of my confusion previously was because I plan to use the S4M in horizontal orientation with feet. But I see when you say "bottom", you mean with the case standing vertically with GPU under mobo (so the left side of the case in your picture).

Now, since the Gigabyte 1060 Mini I have is too tall, i.e. left-to-right in the picture, that brick won't fit without being moved to the front of the case across from the power button (bottom-left of the case in the picture).

For some reason, I just imagined since you said the Dynamo 360 would fit under a Gigabyte Mini, then the AC-DC unit would as well. I didn't realize how big those AC-DC bricks are until looking at the picture for scale.

Thanks again!

 

[matogl0396]

Seeing as your GPU is more than 111.15mm tall, you will need to mount the AC-DC unit on the front inside of the case next to the GPU using some sort of robust double sided adhesive.

Hey, one last question if you would be so kind...

What kind of tape did you use for your brickless S4M? I'm looking at this: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00I4E4HPI/?tag=theminutiae-20. Seems to fit all criteria (thin, double sided, heavy duty, heat resistant), but on the other hand I'm a little worried about being able to remove it easily in the future.

Interested to hear what you chose to use and how it worked out.

Thank you!!

 

[Biowarejak]

I believe it was 3M Thermal Adhesive Tape, but I could be wrong

 

[Kmpkt]

Yeah I believe it was 3M 8810 thermally conductive tape

https://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media...ctive-adhesive-transfer-tapes-8800-series.pdf

 

[matogl0396]

Yeah I believe it was 3M 8810 thermally conductive tape

https://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media...ctive-adhesive-transfer-tapes-8800-series.pdf

Awesome, thanks again.

 

[w5endless]

Seeing as your GPU is more than 111.15mm tall, you will need to mount the AC-DC unit on the front inside of the case next to the GPU using some sort of robust double sided adhesive. If it were 111.15mm or less then you could simply screw it into the provided holes on the bottom interior of the S4M.

The HDPlex 400W AC-DC may fit on the bottom of the case under your GPU, but I don't have exact measurements on the unit's height. Based on napkin math you have about 25mm of height to play with on this.

Hi there ive been on this page for hours looking for answers. I just purchased your power supply dynamo combo with mini and I was wondering, does it have enough wattage and clearance to power an i7 8700k + 1080 ti mini? Please please please answer I ordered all the parts and am stressing about it

 

[Biowarejak]

Hi there ive been on this page for hours looking for answers. I just purchased your power supply dynamo combo with mini and I was wondering, does it have enough wattage and clearance to power an i7 8700k + 1080 ti mini? Please please please answer I ordered all the parts and am stressing about it

You're really pushing the limits, but technically you should be fine if your brick can handle it. Try not to touch any of the PSU parts, brick included. They'll be running hot.

 

[Kmpkt]

Hi there ive been on this page for hours looking for answers. I just purchased your power supply dynamo combo with mini and I was wondering, does it have enough wattage and clearance to power an i7 8700k + 1080 ti mini? Please please please answer I ordered all the parts and am stressing about it

You're really pushing the limits, but technically you should be fine if your brick can handle it. Try not to touch any of the PSU parts, brick included. They'll be running hot.

The Dynamo system should handle the load well enough, you're going to need to get a Eurocom 780 or Lulzbot 500 and a custom power inlet from @Josh | NFC to pull this off though.

 

[w5endless]

The Dynamo system should handle the load well enough, you're going to need to get a Eurocom 780 or Lulzbot 500 and a custom power inlet from @Josh | NFC to pull this off though.

so I will need these in conjunction with the dynamo power supply combo I purchased from the sff labs website? And these all of these fit inside the skyreach 4 mini at the same time? Assume I know nothing about power supplies because I just watched a youtube video explaining the difference between ac and dc. I'm an MRI technologist but I don't have much experience with hardware unfortunately

 

[Biowarejak]

so I will need these in conjunction with the dynamo power supply combo I purchased from the sff labs website? And these all of these fit inside the skyreach 4 mini at the same time? Assume I know nothing about power supplies because I just watched a youtube video explaining the difference between ac and dc. I'm an MRI technologist but I don't have much experience with hardware unfortunately

The brick goes outside the mini. And yes you need to purchase one.