Power Supply & S4M Questions

[SilveredEdge]

Howdy All,

I'm new to the SFF scene and am eyeing the S4M by NFC/Josh. I'd ideally like to use it in the future for portability for gaming with friends and bringing it with me on trips if necessary. Ideally, I'd also like to try and set up a portable karaoke machine with this.

Firstly, I currently have a Core i5-2400 paired with a Gigabyte GA-H61N I don't foresee any problems using this older hardware, but just wanted to confirm. I'd like to reuse as much as possible where i can and upgrade later on. Currently, for a video card i have a XFX R7 250 Low Profile video card but in the short term will upgrade to a 1050ti / 1060. In the long term, based on how often I end up using it, i'll part of my main desktop rig and put in a 1070 or 1080 (or next generation), heat concerns not withstanding.

Secondly, I'm still trying to wrap my head around all the power supply options and terminology. I understand the diminutive size calls for changes in power delivery, but it is mostly over my head. I'm mainly going off what other people have posted and the NFC BOMS.
* Regarding brick-less builds, You need to use the C8 adapter to feed the AC current from the wall into the HDPlex. which then feeds the Dynamo DC power and that distributes powers to the PC components? I'm guessing this just needs a bit of soldering?
* Because the HDPlex 160 does the AC/DC conversion, that's what makes this possible without a brick?
* The beefier builds that require the brick, the brick does the conversion and is able to provide DC power & higher wattage directly (via the laptop-adapter plug) to power supplies like the HDPlex 400/Dynamo 200, correct?
* I think I'm most confused about the combo Dynamo 360/160. What is the intended use for this? I saw this thread am still quite a bit confused as to why you'd need to go this route?

Thanks for all the help yall, I can't wait to start working on this!

 

[Choidebu]

My seasoned fellow forum members and mods... recently this influx of new-to-sff members calls for a sticky of some sort to help them out navigating sff psu scenery. Anyone can answer this call?

* Regarding brick-less builds, You need to use the C8 adapter to feed the AC current from the wall into the HDPlex. which then feeds the Dynamo DC power and that distributes powers to the PC components? I'm guessing this just needs a bit of soldering?

Just have to clarify this: if by hdplex you mean HDPLEX AC/DC adapter, then yes that's how it works.

AC power (110VAC or 220VAC) from the wall is converted to DC power (19VDC in case of hdplex) by a brick or ac/dc adapter. This DC power then is converted and distributed to multiple voltages required by your computer by a DC/ATX psu or DC DC psu.

This is nothing new and it actually what's also happening in ol' regular ATX psu you're used too, also in SFX TFX and so on. The only difference is that they do all that inside a single unit so they take AC and spit out multiple DC voltages.

Some also call it nano psu, and if you see the term direct plug psu, it means that it plugs directly to the 24 atx pin on your motherboard.

Now regarding your question of soldering; hdplex 160W AC/DC adapter comes with modular sockets including C14 socket to connect to wall. If you want C8 as endorsed by NFC's S4M, however, you'll most likely need to solder or crimp some cables. Other than that, no soldering needed.

* Because the HDPlex 160 does the AC/DC conversion, that's what makes this possible without a brick?

Now you're confusing hdplex 160W ac dc with hdplex dc dc psu. You need both. Hdplex 160W ac dc IS a brick. By 'brickless' people mean they put the brick IN the case so they don't have to lug around separate brick apart from their case, like you do on laptops.

* I think I'm most confused about the combo Dynamo 360/160. What is the intended use for this? I saw this thread am still quite a bit confused as to why you'd need to go this route?

Due to size problem (and the resulting heat dissipation problem) only recently you see ac dc bricks bigger than 200W. Hence nano psus, were only made to handle 150~200W. Contrast this with ATX psus where 350W was the norm, and 500W is pretty much standard now.

Because now more people going sff wants to push the limits, they start cramming more resource hungry, ATX desktop intended parts into their build (which, frankly, if you ask me, defeats the purpose of sff - seriously I was more excited about via nano, amd geode and arm, sub 100W builds than cramming rgb and 1080 whatchamacallit in a freakin shoebox; good thing I don't game)
And 200W is not enough anymore. So we see some contenders, like hdplex 300 (now 400), g-unique (500!!!?!).

The dynamo combo aims to contend on this space as well, providing theoretically 360W+160W which is a whopping 520W. The idea is to power your most resource hungry part - the GPU - separately. So your 'ol dynamo 160 can power your mobo+cpu+ssd+hdd, then dynamo 360 can power your wall ripping 1080ti sucking up to 250~300W by itself.

Of course this needs some coordination otherwise your system won't boot coz your gpu is powered too late, or your gpu fan is still whirring when you shutdown the computer etc etc.

Not to mention this is only the dc-dc part of the equation. You'll still need a brick to push out 500W+ (which is ridiculous - seriously, pushing 500W through 20V means 25A, 42A if through 12V - you expect end users to wire that much current? People who static shocks means a trip to a heart doctor? Just let them be content with a box which plugs one end to a wall and other end to their pc) which is expensive and bulky and hot or the combination of all three. Make sure you also buy a third radiator (after your cpu and gpu, duh) for your brick.



Rants aside, welcome to sff world! Hipe you get all that.

 

[SilveredEdge]

Thanks for the call to make this a sticky. I was looking all over for awhile and appreciate your detailed post regarding it. That paired with the tldr from another post recently really puts it into perspective .

Just to retierate and drill it down into my head, in a nutshell we need need ac>dc>atx, it's just all a matter of where the conversions happens .

 

[Josh | NFC]

Dear SilveredEdge,

I do have on the first post of the S4M and S4M-C threads a FAQ. I think these two entries will be helpful:

https://smallformfactor.net/forum/threads/skyreach-4-mini-s4m.5715/page-19#post-77858

https://smallformfactor.net/forum/threads/skyreach-4-mini-s4m.5715/page-62#post-88581

I'm also happy to answer your questions via email. Perhaps I should make another thread and have it sticked for a FAQ--What I need is people to send me links to posts that are helpful as I am compiling a google doc of Q&As.

Thanks, Choidebu for your help.

 

[SilveredEdge]

Dear SilveredEdge,

I do have on the first post of the S4M and S4M-C threads a FAQ. I think these two entries will be helpful:

https://smallformfactor.net/forum/threads/skyreach-4-mini-s4m.5715/page-19#post-77858

https://smallformfactor.net/forum/threads/skyreach-4-mini-s4m.5715/page-62#post-88581

I'm also happy to answer your questions via email. Perhaps I should make another thread and have it sticked for a FAQ--What I need is people to send me links to posts that are helpful as I am compiling a google doc of Q&As.

Thanks, Choidebu for your help.

Thanks Josh,

I planned on reading all 75 pages, but life and impatience get the better of me sometimes. I really do appreciate your involvement, activity, and willingness to help. It definitely has gone noticed and I will take you up on your offer to email you when the time comes. I don't know how you find the time to do all this work and be as involved as you are. It really shows how much sweat, blood, and tears you put into your product and supporting and promoting it.

Thanks again.
-Mark