Cooling Noctua NH-P1 passive cooler. To have or not to have?

[tinyitx]

My last fully passive build was in 2008 with a XFX 7600 GT Fatal1ty in some big ATX case - I like to see if I can put something (for today's standards) similar powerful together in SFF. The biggest challenge will probably be the GPU. Palit makes a passive cooled GTX1650 but it's more or less impossible to get - so I need to think about alternatives...

I have thought briefly about going for a fully passive system. The display card is the hardest problem. Palit 1650 Kalmx seems to be the most powerful card but it is not available anywhere and, frankly, it is not powerful enough for me.
Then, I researched about using a 3rd party aftermarket cooler. Arctic Accelero S3 seems to be the most capable but it can only cool up to a 1060 level and will need an additional fan to cool a 1070/Ti.
So, I sure like to know what you end up with.

Oh nice ! What's this chassis ? Also, does the NH-P1 protrudes past the IO shield ?

it's the ZS-OC v1 open case. and I believe the P1 does not protrude past the IO shield.

The NH-P1 does protrude beyond the IO shield, the outermost fin by about 2mm and then those 6 heatpipe tips by yet another 8-9mm.
Let me give you a 1000-word description.

Noctua maintains a list of cases on compatibility. This list looks updated as it includes Formd, SSUPD...etc relatively new brands. But somehow it lists Streacom's open benches BC1 and BC1 Mini as ''insufficient clearance''.

 

[tinyitx]

I have checked 7-8 reviews to see their mobo + case combination.
For those who fitted the mobo + NH-P1 assembly into a case, the mobo is of ATX format.
For 1 (or 2) review who used an ITX mobo, the reviewer used an open test bench.

So, it seems the NH-P1 will protrude beyond the mobo IO if an ITX mobo is used, thus making it impossible to fit the assembly into a case (unless the case is modded, of course). Obviously, this is due to the fact that ITX mobo packs onboard components much more tightly (than ATX mobos) and the CPU socket is just located nearer to the IO edge.

BUT, do not get despair! The NH-P1 can be installed with the heatpipes pointing the opposite way, ie hanging over the RAM. As such, lower profile memory modules should be used. My G Skill Trident Z (44mm tall) barely fits and Corsair LPX (34mm) fits beautifully.

 

[tinyitx]

I am a little puzzled as the SSD temp seems to drop down to low 40's in the past day or so, without me doing anything. This temp is 'Normal' (according to Samsung). I am wondering if this has been a false alarm.

One possible explanation for the high 'idle/light load' temp is that it was not actually idling but Windows was doing something in the background without telling me.

Anyway, I now need to play a little Sherlock Holmes and make a longer observation over a week or two. It is imperative to find out what the pattern is in a longer term than just in a day or two.

I will report if there is anything new in this regard.

 

[GuilleAcoustic]

BUT, do not get despair! The NH-P1 can be installed with the heatpipes pointing the opposite way, ie hanging over the RAM. As such, lower profile memory modules should be used. My G Skill Trident Z (44mm tall) barely fits and Corsair LPX (34mm) fits beautifully.

Well .... I have 32GB B-die Dominator Platinum .... That won't fit .

 

[rfarmer]

This is a pretty nice build @tinyitx,

 

[tinyitx]

This is a pretty nice build @tinyitx,

Indeed, it is pretty. The 8-star lens filter effect contributes a lot.

Aesthetically, it is .
Functionally/thermally, it is .

Of all the possible orientations, this is the worst. Natural convection is impeded. Hot air just cannot rise easily due to those fins in a horizontal position.

Group A (blue, grey and green) beats Group B (orange, yellow) by a whopping difference of 20-21°C !!
This is for an i5-11400 CPU, a 65W moderate TDP CPU. I can imagine it will become worse for a higher TDP CPU.



On another note, I found an Asus thermal sensor cable in my spare parts box and put it in to do some thermal probing around.

 

[tinyitx]

Well .... I have 32GB B-die Dominator Platinum .... That won't fit .

I guess you cannot have it all. Of these four (the case, an ITX mobo, tall ram and NH-P1), you can only pick 3.

 

[lys1030]

I purchased NH-P1 on day one. I'm currently hunting for a Palit GeForce GTX 1650 KalmX and once I get it, I'll build a passively cooled Xproto-mini with 5600x and HDPlex 400w psu.

 

[tinyitx]

I purchased NH-P1 on day one. I'm currently hunting for a Palit GeForce GTX 1650 KalmX and once I get it, I'll build a passively cooled Xproto-mini with 5600x and HDPlex 400w psu.

I expect you will have three (at least) challenges lying ahead of you.

One is, of course, the hunt for a Palit 1650 KalmX. When you do discover availability, be sure to let member @REVOCCASES know as he is also looking for one.

The 2nd one is, Palit 1650 KalmX is 178x138x38 mm and Xproto-Mini lists 210x130x55 mm as GPU limitation. The extra 8mm in width might pose a potential physical conflict?

The 3rd one is, due to AMD CPU socket being rectangular, the NH-P1 can only be installed in 2 orientations instead of 4. Both orientations will have the fins in a horizontal position. This has a significant negative impact on the natural convection. ()

Nonetheless, I look forward to your build!

 

[tinyitx]

@REVOCCASES

Check this out. Not sure how legitimate.

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[lys1030]

I expect you will have three (at least) challenges lying ahead of you.

One is, of course, the hunt for a Palit 1650 KalmX. When you do discover availability, be sure to let member @REVOCCASES know as he is also looking for one.

The 2nd one is, Palit 1650 KalmX is 178x138x38 mm and Xproto-Mini lists 210x130x55 mm as GPU limitation. The extra 8mm in width might pose a potential physical conflict?

The 3rd one is, due to AMD CPU socket being rectangular, the NH-P1 can only be installed in 2 orientations instead of 4. Both orientations will have the fins in a horizontal position. This has a significant negative impact on the natural convection. ()

Nonetheless, I look forward to your build!

Yep, I may need to lay down the xpm case for better airflow. Not super certain about the gpu size compatibility though. I've been searching for this specific gpu for a long time (long before NH-P1 release), but have no result.

 

[tinyitx]

Heatpipes are soldered to each fins instead of just contact by pressure. I believe this is crucial to maximize the heat transfer to make the P1 effective.

Note the level of soldering is the highest.

(source: https://greentechreviews.ru/2021/07/13/obzor-protsessornogo-kulera-noctua-nh-p1/)

 

[tinyitx]

Update

1. Samsung magician is not as smart as I thought

What it is now:- it reports 'Normal' when the Nand temp is below 50°C. It reports 'High' when the Nand temp is equal to or above 50°C. This is 'lazy' code writing.

What it should be:- loading of the SSD needs to be taken into account of. Obviously, a 55°C temp for an 1% loading SSD vs a 55°C temp for a SSD under 99% loading should be distinquished. The former situation should not be classified as 'Normal' while the latter should be. The relationship between the loading and the temperature should not be disregarded.

(And to be fair, Magician is not the only one. CrystalDiskInfo also does the same thing!)

2. The recent high temp is most likely due to higher ambient temp. Just during that week when I switched from fanned C14S to fanless P1, a heat wave arrived on the same week! Now, when my a/c brings the room ambient temp down to around 25-26C, SSD hovers around mid 40's C, which is more acceptable.

So, instead of using a Cryorig SSD heatsink, I will apply some Enzotech little copper heatsinks on top of Asus' heatsink to give additional mass and surface area to see if there are noticeable improvement. Will report later.

3. The NH-P1 is my first passive CPU cooler and it brings me 2 new experience. One is that, without the fan blocking the view of the cooler, I have full view of the cooler. All the fins (I would rather call them 'plates' as they are so thick) are now exposed for me to see, enhancing the raw robust industrial look. Two is that, without a constantly spinning fan, there is a 'weird' sense of serenity. As the PSU and GPU fans are also not spinning, the whole system seems so 'peaceful' and so 'calm'. The feeling is a little strange. One 1 hand, you know the PC is turned on and is working to do its job. One the other hand, nothing is moving. This contrast is so 'surreal'. I like this and I do not miss the CPU fan.

 

[Arboreal]

The NH-P1 is my first passive CPU cooler and it brings me 2 new experience. One is that, without the fan blocking the view of the cooler, I have full view of the cooler. All the fins (I would rather call them 'plates' as they are so thick) are now exposed for me to see, enhancing the raw robust industrial look. Two is that, without a constantly spinning fan, there is a 'weird' sense of serenity. As the PSU and GPU fans are also not spinning, the whole system seems so 'peaceful' and so 'calm'. The feeling is a little strange. One 1 hand, you know the PC is turned on and is working to do its job. One the other hand, nothing is moving. This contrast is so 'surreal'. I like this and I do not miss the CPU fan.

That does 'sound' impressive!

I have been meaning to do a 'No Moving Parts' (someone suggested 'Zero Moving Parts' would sound better), build for some time.

I have an i5 7500T and a DDR4 SODIMM, and thin ITX compatible PSU brick, so a Q170T would be great if I could find one at a decent price.
There is a Gigabyte industrial board on the 'bay currently, but I have spent all my PC funds on panels for my DIY Revoccases BIG560 build.

 

[tinyitx]

That does 'sound' impressive!

I have been meaning to do a 'No Moving Parts' (someone suggested 'Zero Moving Parts' would sound better), build for some time.

I have an i5 7500T and a DDR4 SODIMM, and thin ITX compatible PSU brick, so a Q170T would be great if I could find one at a decent price.
There is a Gigabyte industrial board on the 'bay currently, but I have spent all my PC funds on panels for my DIY Revoccases BIG560 build.

The main challenge of a 'No Moving Parts' build is the GPU. Aside from modding with 3rd party heatsink, the best fanless card is Palit's 1650 KalmX, which is a hard-to-get card. But, if one does not game, I suppose using the iGPU can be a good solution.

 

[tinyitx]

Update

Installed an array of Enzotech little heatsinks onto the Asus's stock M.2 cover heatsink to increase the mass and the total surface area, thus improving the natural convection.
Too early to tell the scale of the thermal benefit. Need to observe longer.

 

[GuilleAcoustic]

I suppose using the iGPU can be a good solution.

That's exactly my situation ... But ambient often rise to 30C in my flat during summer. Still debating the best solution for my use case (custom case design)

Installed an array of Enzotech little heatsinks

Hell yeah ! Been a fan of Enzotech for as long as I can remember.

 

[Arboreal]

The main challenge of a 'No Moving Parts' build is the GPU. Aside from modding with 3rd party heatsink, the best fanless card is Palit's 1650 KalmX, which is a hard-to-get card. But, if one does not game, I suppose using the iGPU can be a good solution.

Very true, I was not even thinking of a GPU based system for this setup. I think that would be a step too far for starters.
I had a passive HD4770 years ago, which was fine, but was still better with airflow over it.

 

[rfarmer]

Here you go @tinyitx.

 

[tinyitx]

Here you go @tinyitx.

First of all, kudos to him finding the rare Palit 1650 KalmX! I imagine being a Hardware Canucks reviewer does have some edge over an average customer as far as getting hard-to-find hardware from Amazon is concerned.

I think he is a little whimpy to choose an i5 11400. The NH-P1 could handle a stronger CPU.

And, adding that side fan does 'ruin' the system's passivity. But, on the other hand, even without that side fan, the system is still not
100% fanless or passive because the Asus Z590I Gaming has a little VRM fan inside the IO enclosure. When he comments on the VRM temp, that Hwinfo shows the little fan is 1700rpm.

Lastly, I wish he would comment on the M.2 SSD temp. His setup (with or without the side fan), the M.2 SSD might have a chance of thermal issue. But, perhaps the low ambient temp (22.5C) might just save the day.

I wonder if there will ever be a better GPU passive card in the future.

Well done overall.