News MSI Vortex?

iFreilicht

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I'm pretty sure it was covered during CES, there were short discussions about it on various other forums, too. Raid 4 is a funny buzzword, at least they're explaining what it actually means.

IIRC, the price for the fully kitted version is something like 4500$ USD. Not surprising considering all the custom hardware.
 

PlayfulPhoenix

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And that's the thing - it's awesome for what it is, but it isn't upgradable practically speaking, and it's really expensive for the hardware. In some ways, more so even than the Mac Pro, which has pretty dated hardware at this point.
 

jØrd

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Exclusive Super RAID 4 (Dual NVMe M.2 SSDs by PCIe Gen3 X4 in RAID 0)

sooooo, raid 0 then
 

PlayfulPhoenix

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I'm sure the next version of the Vortex will come with "80% more gimmicks" XD

"Now with racing stripes to make it go faster!"
 
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PlayfulPhoenix

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MSI's feeling so generous, it being special circumstances and all, that they'll knock a hundred dollars off of that TruCoat.

Lemme tell you, once you get oxidation on the undercarriage, fixing that's gunna cost you way more than five hundred dollars...
 

QinX

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Except the less cylindrical shape and the lack of single "core" heatsink .... this is really similar to the MacPro. Pretty disapointing to see such a lack of inspiration ....
I don't agree with that statement. MSI has done some pretty interesting things.
For one the amount of "custom" parts is fairly low, at least compared to the Mac Pro. Also the use of bus bars to deliver power to the various components is a very nice way of reducing the need for big traces or messy wiring. Also the cooling system is wel designed for what it needs to do.

My only real gripes are the price, but you can't argue that this isn't a super high volume product and the difficulty of upgrading/inability, you have to void the warranty to change the RAM or M.2 drives.
Ofcourse the design isn't what I'd like but it isn't the worst either.
 

GuilleAcoustic

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1 main board + 2 GPU boards .... placed in a prisme shape .... sorry but this is the same.



Except the cooling (outer sides heatsink i/o central unique) and cabling .... this is the same layout.



They even use the same kind of top fan :



.... versus MacPro ....

 
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iFreilicht

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1 main board + 2 GPU boards .... placed in a prisme shape .... sorry but this is the same.

Siding with QinX here, just because it's roughly the same shape, it's not same at all. The design is completely different, the component choice and implementation as well.

So many people complain about PC cases just being plain boring boxes, it feels wrong to throw shade at MSI for making something that is very different from nearly all PCs on the market.
 

GuilleAcoustic

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Siding with QinX here, just because it's roughly the same shape, it's not same at all. The design is completely different, the component choice and implementation as well.

Components choice is not so different ... still a CPU + 2 GPU in a prism shape. Same fan, that could even be the exact same model if you look at its shape.

So many people complain about PC cases just being plain boring boxes, it feels wrong to throw shade at MSI for making something that is very different from nearly all PCs on the market.

I'm really not an Apple fan, I'm even the exact opposite ... but while I agree that we need more options, the truth is that it is too similar to Apple MacPro.

This is the same with games, movies, music ... when something works then people use the design 'til the overdose. Seriously, there are tones of possibilities but designers prefer the confort of copying rather than taking risks.

CPU board + 2 GPU boards, prism shape, single top tangential fan .... this is the Mac Pro design. They even put the M.2 slots on the GPU board, like Apple did ... only difference is that both GPU board have an M.2 slot, unlike the Mac Pro that has a single M.2 slot.

I'm glad that we have an alternative to the MacPro .... but this can't be advertised as being an original design, too many similarities. This is even more a MacPro clone than the Dune case which copied the outer shell.
 
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jeshikat

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I think we can agree that MSI is copying the idea of a compact cylindrical case, but the similarities of the internal layout is just due to geometry. A prism arrangement is the most efficient way to fit 3 large PCBs inside a cylinder while leaving room for cooling, PSU, etc.
 

EdZ

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The Vortex is actually the inverse of the Mac Pro: The Mac Pro has three PCBs surrounding a central shared heatsink, and the power supply stuck on the outside. The Vortex has three PCBs with individual heatsinks surrounding them, and the PSU slid down the central cavity. While the compact arrangement of the Vorxtex can't be matched with commodity components, the arrangement could be replicated with standard PCIe cards, a flex PCIe riser + splitter (and a motherboard that supports bifurcation) and a FlexATX supply slid down the middle. It would be wider and taller than the Vortex or Mac Pro through, but you could still get the advantage of a single shared wide-diameter cooling fan.
 
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PlayfulPhoenix

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Sorry, pretty bad days lately, nightmares and sleep deprivation doesn't mix very well. This prism + copy-cat fan drove me nuts XD. Guess I over reacted ....

I mean, it isn't as if there aren't stark similarities, it's just that beyond the relative shape/size and the "prism" orientation of components, almost everything else was executed pretty differently.

Honestly, I think that the best argument for calling the Vortex distinct from the Mac Pro is to show how ugly and inelegant the inside (and outside, IMO, though aesthetics are highly subjective) of the Vortex is. Instead of Apple's unified thermal core that actively cools everything, the board and graphics have independent heatsinks that bloat the case and provide substantially less area for the top fan to channel air through. The plastic construction belies the $4,000+ price point, even as Apple's US-made all-aluminum case is 33% less expensive. Cables are strewn everywhere internally, and they took no care in trying to make the inside look remotely presentable. They've even had to mount most of the components off-axis and at awkward or unusual angles, presumably to try to compensate for all the metal and hardware that has to exist on the outside of the "prism". And all of this compromise, for no real practical benefit to the end user - in practice, none of this hardware is going to be replaceable, that already isn't in the Mac Pro.

They did all those things because they wanted to save money, bluntly. You can argue that they "invested" those savings in more powerful components in comparison to the Mac Pro, but they're also asking for $1,000 more, and that's a comparison to a machine that was last updated in 2013. Hardly a benchmark to be comparing a 2016 machine to.

IMO, the only reason to buy this right now is because the hardware in the Mac Pro is so dated (especially the graphics), and because some folks who want the best won't miss $4,000. But that disparity is likely not going to be the case come June, and in almost every other way - price, component quality, build and materials quality, size, and compatibility (can run all the OS's), the Mac Pro is objectively better. Even for a PC diehard that would never use OS X, I can't see a compelling reason to recommend a base Vortex over an updated Mac Pro running Windows, whenever that arrives.

(Unless MSI slashes the price, of course, which they might, and I really hope they do.)
 

Phuncz

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I've seen the entire video from Linus dismantling it and while it's just basically a rolled-up laptop (MSI knows laptops), the PCH daughterboard was a very good idea from the designers. I am glad they choose to incorporate the PSU and not have one or two mammoth bricks hiding somewhere. If only the design wasn't so GAMING RAWR FIREBREATHING DRAGONS.
 
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