Clueless annoying users

[Choidebu]

I believe we all see these kind of users anywhere on any forum:

Hey do you know how much and how do I buy this insert-a-not-yet-released-product-here?

Hey what is random-detail-info-that-is-literally-on-the-product-page-sheet of blabla ?

Like, why tf do they post, or ask, on an unrelated forum, a random tidbits that you can just google? If it can be crawled, it can be indexed. It will show up on google. Why waste other's time and attention? If you're a coder then you prob know stackoverflow. Same thing there.

I know knowledge level discrepancy is a fact. But a baseline should exists. Somewhere. No? Are people just that stupid?

 

[VegetableStu]

I feel like there's the mental resistance in new things, which leads to needing social confirmation for assertion of facts/direction

Also when they're learning to do something and the project's treated like a "only have one shot at this" thing (maybe due to not being able to afford spares), they tend to want to overthink to make up for not wanting to overdo.

At least that's how I feel

 

[Kmpkt]

Part of this site and forum becoming the internet's go to for SFF is that we're going to attract people who are complete neophytes as well as people that are completely and totally lazy. In the case of people who are really new to building, I just try to remember that I was there once and should be as helpful and tolerant as possible.

I think it is quite likely that the uninitiated won't even realize there is a difference between true SFF and a normal MATX PC. They simply look at this site as a resource for information. I think that relative to their experiences in the large form factor world they are building small and this seems like the right place to go. If you Google small PC forum, ITX PC forum or any similar terms, these forums are either the #1 hit or very close to the top. As an embarrassing anecdote, when I first registered for OC.net a number of years ago to access the SFF sub-forum it was for questions regarding my newly purchased Bitfenix Prodigy and the P8Z77-I deluxe I planned to put into it.

As far as the really lazy people go, I just try to remember that the fine people who run this website need as much traffic as possible to make this site successful. I hate the lazy more than most and will probably take my digs at them when able, but I do force myself to consider John, James and Josh before getting too harsh. Ultimately I think if we let either elitism or intolerance of the beginner creep into this forum then the overall feeling for new users of all levels will be that this is an unfriendly environment. One of the things I love about this community is that it is unbelievably friendly, hugely inclusive and free of conflict. I would personally prefer to keep it that way.

 

[IntoxicatedPuma]

when I first registered for OC.net a number of years ago to access the SFF sub-forum it was for questions regarding my newly purchased Bitfenix Prodigy and the P8Z77-I deluxe I planned to put into it.

I have been kind of a smartass to some people on the OC.net about their builds like that and calling it "SFF", but in hindsight it probably didn't change their mind and just made me look like a dick.

 

[Necere]

I think it's important to remember that the person on the other side of the screen could be anyone, and not everyone has the same experience or cognitive resources you or I might:

• They might be an older person who isn't very good with computers, or whose cognition is in decline
• They might be a child or young person
• They might not know how to go about finding the information they want
• They might not have a lot of time to spend searching for answers
• They might not be a native english speaker

The point is, we shouldn't judge too easily. it's impossible to know someone's situation based on a single post on the internet, and it might be a lot more understandable if we did know.

 

[XeaLouS]

Some of the threads are super long (e.g. LZ7) and questions are frequently re-asked.
For example, i frequently need to visit the page about fan grill patterns and I find it difficult to find in search (i find it after opening 4-5 links in the search menu though).

If you were new to the site and didn't know that some information was already mentioned (like this case in point), you definitely wouldn't find it within 2-3 clicks in the search function and resort to... re-asking *gasp*

 

[Biowarejak]

I definitely understand the frustration - but I personally feel that the other points raised here are more important than personal indignation (on my part). For the most part I think we succeed in doing what we can to help users find the answers themselves, and affirming information, but we can't make them put the effort in. Our community is incredibly inclusive, part of that comes from our general willingness to help.

That said, I wish that more of them would put some effort in.

 

[Choidebu]

I agree that this forum is, when tech is involved, one of the friendliest I've been. Others ([H]? OCxx?) does sometimes have those elitist vibe that @Kmpkt mentioned. This is what makes me subscribed in the first place.

Can't help it, can we?

 

[Phuncz]

The only way we, as a community, can help is by being an accepting community that teaches, this way people pick up faster and maybe end up helping the community too, in the same way.

 

[Aichon]

As someone who is new—both to the forum and to the SFF topic in general—the reason I created an account here was because I could see at a glance that this community is mature, friendly, laser-focused, and actively engaged with the movers and shakers in this field.

While I haven’t had to ask any questions here just yet, I do know that as a newbie I oftentimes don’t even know the right terms to search for or what options are possible, meaning that Google proves no help. Having a human who can understand your problem and point you in a direction where you can learn more is incredibly beneficial, and in the end it lifts the whole community up, not just that person. It’s one of the things that this site does really well.

Frankly, you guys have something special here. You’ve struck the perfect balance, and though I don’t know if you can hold onto it forever as this community grows, you should definitely try to hang onto the maturity and civility you have here for as long as you can, because once it’s gone, it’s gone.

 

[bledha]

I think it's important to remember that the person on the other side of the screen could be anyoneThey might be an older person who isn't very good with computersThey might not know how to go about finding the information they wantThey might not have a lot of time to spend searching for answers

These are very important points. My father is a great example of this. He is a hydraulic mechanic (and an extremely competent automotive tech), but cannot use a computer worth a darn. If he ever got into something like SFF builds, he would certainly be here annoying people with questions also due to the fact that he doesn't trust most the stuff he reads on the internet unless he can get real time information from someone who is more personable. He is also older, so even navigating to a website on a PC is not a normal daily thing like it clearly is more the majority of us here. Just isn't a natural thing for him.

I mean, I would ask him about 50 times how to remove an air-brake chamber assembly from a tractor trailer before something exploded if I was interested in that as well. SFF stuff is just that, just as foreign to some people and spreading the wealth of knowledge seems to be a major thrust as to why this sort of thing exists. They used to share ideas at the forums in ancient Rome...

one of the friendliest I've been. Others ([H]? OCxx?) does sometimes have those elitist vibe that @Kmpkt mentioned. This is what makes me subscribed in the first place.

Yes, although threads titled "Clueless annoying users" seem to lean again toward that elitist vibe...

The only way we, as a community, can help is by being an accepting community that teaches, this way people pick up faster and maybe end up helping the community too, in the same way.

YES

hang onto the maturity and civility

YES!

It is what attracted me here too, even as a seasoned technician and specialist. If the annoying questions get to you just (virtually) stroll past. Either someone with more patience will help them, or if it is truly a useless/annoying cause - they will be left to their devices for SFF survival as it should be.

 

[laughing man]

And part of the problem is that BASIC information is completely neglected by the manufacturer. Like how hot should a Ryzen run? This should be clearly indicated by AMD, but is not. Or what are the measurements of a graphics card? This should be on the sales site but took a call to the manufacturer to find (and manufacturers have HORRIBLE customer service that BARELY knows any english much of the time. I gave up on trying to get info from Biostar). Or what is the height of a Ryzen cooler? Why the fuck do I have to look all over the god damned internet, with crap loads of bogus answers supplied instead of hard manufacturer supplied specs, for shit that should be CLEARLY AND EASILY viewable on the manufacturer web site?! I mean, WTF is wrong with the shit heads that run these companies? I get all this sorry crap assed advertising bullshit, but you can't tell me how fucking tall that sorry assed cooler is or how much space it needs to breath? I mean, really?

No information is included on I/O plates in the instruction manual and EVERYONE has a different answer as to why they exist.

Then there are things like the Arctic Silver instructions which can be confusing. Am I supposed to "RECHECK" the heat sink paste AFTER putting down the heatsink? "RECHECK" at what point?

In my view, the easiest solution would be to have a group of hackers hack the main websites of the companies that make this hardware and replace the front pages of those sites with "WE DON'T GIVE A FUCK ABOUT YOUR MARKETING BULLSHIT! PUT UP THE SPECS AND AND INCLUDE SHIT IN THE INSTRUCTIONS!!!!" in white bold impact font on a black background. I really don't think the cocksuckers that run these companies are going to listen otherwise.

Also, stop complaining. If you don't want people to ask questions, well, you shouldn't have made a forum. That's about the only purpose this place serves is it give people new to SFF a place to ask questions and thereby promote SFF by making it more easily accessible.

 

[Biowarejak]

And part of the problem is that BASIC information is completely neglected by the manufacturer. Like how hot should a Ryzen run? This should be clearly indicated by AMD, but is not. Or what are the measurements of a graphics card? This should be on the sales site but took a call to the manufacturer to find (and manufacturers have HORRIBLE customer service that BARELY knows any english much of the time. I gave up on trying to get info from Biostar). Or what is the height of a Ryzen cooler? Why the fuck do I have to look all over the god damned internet, with crap loads of bogus answers supplied instead of hard manufacturer supplied specs, for shit that should be CLEARLY AND EASILY viewable on the manufacturer web site?! I mean, WTF is wrong with the shit heads that run these companies? I get all this sorry crap assed advertising bullshit, but you can't tell me how fucking tall that sorry assed cooler is or how much space it needs to breath? I mean, really?

No information is included on I/O plates in the instruction manual and EVERYONE has a different answer as to why they exist.

Then there are things like the Arctic Silver instructions which can be confusing. Am I supposed to "RECHECK" the heat sink paste AFTER putting down the heatsink? "RECHECK" at what point?

In my view, the easiest solution would be to have a group of hackers hack the main websites of the companies that make this hardware and replace the front pages of those sites with "WE DON'T GIVE A FUCK ABOUT YOUR MARKETING BULLSHIT! PUT UP THE SPECS AND AND INCLUDE SHIT IN THE INSTRUCTIONS!!!!" in white bold impact font on a black background. I really don't think the cocksuckers that run these companies are going to listen otherwise.

Also, stop complaining. If you don't want people to ask questions, well, you shouldn't have made a forum. That's about the only purpose this place serves is it give people new to SFF a place to ask questions and thereby promote SFF by making it more easily accessible.

Hey now... You're not wrong but the frustration is valid and indicative of the much larger problem you addressed. As a forum, we can help alleviate these concerns for our users.

 

[laughing man]

Also, I gotta ask? Why isn't the faceplate interface connector standardized? Why are there always all these itty bitty connectors? Why aren't the motherboard screws thumbscrews that can be held onto while putting them in? Why are all the fan and psu connectors so hard to grab? I was trying to remove my fan connector and mistakenly thought it had a hook lock on it and was using a screwedriver to unlatch. After smacking my mother board with the screw driver when it slipped, a potentially catastrophic issue, I found that the fan connector had no hook, it was just hard to remove because there is nothing to grab onto and I don't want to yank on the wires themselves. Why such poor ergonomic design?

It is like the whole process of a PC build could be made much easier if the people who design these things actually cared about what they are doing. It is almost like they hate us and want to make it hard.

 

[confusis]

Right, I understand the frustrations going on here, but the language and aggressiveness is getting out of hand. Consider this locked.