Traveling Retro Gamer - Brickless S4M w/ 7600K, 1070

[SilverJS]

Ah - when @Kmpkt did it with the Y-controller linked above (that's where I got the idea - I'm nowhere near smart enough to think up this stuff), he was using HDPLEX 160 AC-DC's...maybe they can handle that somehow. I think he was saying he tested it successfully, but ultimately abandoned the build...(Orangulan Part Deux or something, it was called, I think.)

So you're thinking - UHP-200-12 and RPS-200-12, hooked up in serial for 24V, into the KMPKT 360+160? Problem is, I don't know where to fit all this stuff! =) I can fit any two of three (UHP, RPS, 360), but not all three, with a decent GPU. In his build, KMPKT had planned to have @Josh | NFC build him a custom side panel to accommodate the 360. Don't know where that went, especially now that the project is abandoned - maybe I'll ask Josh, but I think he's busy with other things right now. Poor guy, I'm bugging him about all kinds of stuff all the time...heart of gold, that one.

 

[Thehack]

What is your continuous power consumption? Let's start from there.

 

[SilverJS]

Well - I'd like to power a 7700K and RTX2060, possibly RTX2070. The UHP-200 allowed me to run the 7600K undervolted, and the 1070 at 75% power limit. So I guess that's my baseline. I'd like to run the 7700K at stock clocks (I'll undervolt for sure still, just for thermals and power efficiency), and the GPU at stock power setting with overclock.

Not sure if that answers your question...?

 

[Thehack]

Well - I'd like to power a 7700K and RTX2060, possibly RTX2070. The UHP-200 allowed me to run the 7600K undervolted, and the 1070 at 75% power limit. So I guess that's my baseline. I'd like to run the 7700K at stock clocks (I'll undervolt for sure still, just for thermals and power efficiency), and the GPU at stock power setting with overclock.

Not sure if that answers your question...?

Okay. So about 260W continuous.

Would the HD-PLEX 400W ac-dc be a good fit? It's width of 58mm is just one off from the S4M 57mm height, so you can mount it in the side position. I haven't followed that thread closely to know if it fits there.

I expect mounting it in the front would be very dumb since the gpu would dump heat on it.

What about something like the Artesyn 250W psu? Gives you a bit more headroom.

 

[CARC Mini]

This made me rethink the whole brick/brickless situation. That made me go back to the dual-Meanwell idea, which I still haven't abandoned (can't seem to let it go!). Twisted my head in knots trying to find a way to fit the UHP, RPS, KMPKT 360 and this Y controller :

http://www.mini-box.com/Y-PWR-Hot-Swap-Load-Sharing-Controller

Alas, I simply could not and had to give up on the idea. Basic premise was to use my UHP-200-24, get an RPS-200-24 and sum them into the KMPKT 360+160. Still would be the ideal solution but I don't think it's possible. Maybe, MAYBE, with two RPS's on the front panel, with at least the GPU one actively cooled (they're 40mm "high", so one could add a 40mm fan too right beside them). But you'd have to get a custom front panel, move power button to the back...blah.

you do realize that only 1 power unit [600W] is needed, & that it fits in a SkyReach S4 Mini ?? - https://store.supermicro.com/600w-1u-pws-606p-1r.html

 

[SilverJS]

Agreed that 260-275W would be fine.

Ah - that 400W HDPLEX unit has everyone waiting on bated breath. The problem is, it's too big. It's made so that it fits in the S4M (but not specifically FOR the S4M - or that's my understanding), and totally will, but it's too...deep, or "high", depending on how you look at it. It would take too much room for the GPU. The only GPU that fits with it is something like a Vega 56 Nano (see how little above the PCIe bracket that card protrudes). I think - THINK - the Galax two-fan cards could also fit. But, they're not available in North America that I know of, so not really an option. But yes, that 400W unit would be perfect, it's just a bit big. Speaking only for myself, I really wish they could have made it a bit smaller, even at the expense of some power capacity, to make it smaller and therefore more usable with a GPU in an S4M - but alas, we're not the only target demographic for it. Either way, it'll be a fantastic piece of kit for sure.

The Artesyn - you mean this ? :

https://www.mouser.ca/ProductDetail...3th5F8koGFQ%2bual28tbFx8kvNYKPd9twSJZI2CNfA==

Only issue there is 150W convection. I could TRY to mount a 40MM fan right next to it, blowing along its length. I THINK that could work.

How about this one?

https://www.mouser.ca/ProductDetail...3th5F8koJlxMu8VzQFe3QDS%2bj2SfWPHVP1fpjGNoA==

Pretty expensive, I'll give you that - but still close to the price of two separate power supplies, plus load switch, etc.... Biggest thing is, I don't see a requirement for external cooling...(Never mind, it does need it too, now that I looked at it again.) Almost double the price for an extra 50W...hmmm.

But you've given me interesting leads here. I could put the KMPKT360 by the GPU (it's only 19MM high), and use that extra space by the mobo for a bigger, 40mm internal PSU. I'll keep looking on Mouser to see what I can find. But, that Artesyn is a good start for sure! Thanks for that!

 

[CARC Mini]

The problem is, it's too big. It's made so that it fits in the S4M (but not specifically FOR the S4M - or that's my understanding), and totally will, but it's too...deep, or "high", depending on how you look at it. It would take too much room for the GPU. The only GPU that fits with it is something like a Vega 56 Nano (see how little above the PCIe bracket that card protrudes). I think - THINK - the Galax two-fan cards could also fit. But, they're not available in North America that I know of, so not really an option. But yes, that 400W unit would be perfect, it's just a bit big. Speaking only for myself, I really wish they could have made it a bit smaller, even at the expense of some power capacity, to make it smaller and therefore more usable with a GPU in an S4M - but alas, we're not the only target demographic for it. Either way, it'll be a fantastic piece of kit for sure.

solved this already, see above.

 

[SilverJS]

you do realize that only 1 power unit [ 600W ] is needed, & that it fits in a SkyReach S4 Mini ?? - https://store.supermicro.com/600w-1u-pws-606p-1r.html

Whoa.

Whoa.

No, I most certainly did NOT realize this beast existed. This changes a LOT of things. My mind's kinda going crazy now - I'd be stuck using the 180mm-ish GPU's, but whatever, even the new RTX GPU's are coming out in that form factor courtesy of MSI and Gigabyte.

OK, now you REALLY got me thinking. How do I hook it up to the rest of the system though...? Do I still need my 360? I couldn't even find output voltage for that thing...

I can't even seem to find out how the heck this connects to a system at all...!

 

[CARC Mini]

Whoa.

Whoa.

No, I most certainly did NOT realize this beast existed. This changes a LOT of things. My mind's kinda going crazy now - I'd be stuck using the 180mm-ish GPU's, but whatever, even the new RTX GPU's are coming out in that form factor courtesy of MSI and Gigabyte.

OK, now you REALLY got me thinking. How do I hook it up to the rest of the system though...? Do I still need my 360? I couldn't even find output voltage for that thing...

its 12V, so you could use it with the Distro 400 [ https://smallformfactor.net/forum/threads/one2-distro-400-a-12v-power-distribution-board.7687/ ] ,when it comes out.

 

[SilverJS]

OK, but how do I hook it up to the Distro 400? I don't see any outputs on that power supply (still reading up on it).

 

[CARC Mini]

OK, but how do I hook it up to the Distro 400? I don't see any outputs on that power supply (still reading up on it).

ask @Josh | NFC ,to make you a custom Molex cabling.

in order to do these brickless builds properly, you need a custom grounded cable going to the wall anyway, such as a 4-pin GX16.

unless you want to burn your house down, by being un-grounded.

so you might as well kill 2 birds with 1 stone, & ask for this other custom cabling, at the same time.

 

[SilverJS]

No, I mean - on the 12V end? For the C14 (AC) end, it's pretty easy - I'd just take a regular C14 power cord, plug it into the C14 of that Supermicro, cut it to length and solder it to my existing C6 connector at the back. There, done - but, I don't see any computer-type outputs after that on the supermicro.

Is it those big spade slots I see on the back?

 

[CARC Mini]

No, I mean - on the 12V end? For the C14 (AC) end, it's pretty easy - I'd just take a regular C14 power cord, plug it into the C14 of that Supermicro, cut it to length and solder it to my existing C6 connector at the back. There, done - but, I don't see any computer-type outputs after that on the supermicro.

Is it those big spade slots I see on the back?

i fixed my typo.

output is " 54.5 Wide Molex " .

and C6 is not rated for 400- 600W.

 

[SilverJS]

Looks like I would need this...? :

https://store.supermicro.com/pdb-pt813m-2424-power-distributor.html

I'm probably missing something.

and C6 is not rated for 400-600W.

https://www.schurter.com/datasheet/0724

7A @ 125V = 875W? Or am I missing something yet again....? =) (Quite likely, in my sleep-deprived state. Speaking of which...)

 

[CARC Mini]

Looks like I would need this...? :

https://store.supermicro.com/pdb-pt813m-2424-power-distributor.html

sure.

i was just trying to support @Josh | NFC ,& send him some business.

 

[SilverJS]

OK, going to bed. Much thanks to all - but, the more I think about it, the more I think that Artesyn 250W that @Thehack suggested might be just the ticket. Sufficient wattage, proper dimensions, affordable, and no tomfoolery with combining power supplies. I like it a lot.

 

[aquelito]

I've got the Artesyn in my Neutrino build works like a charm.

It's rated for 150W passive though, you'll need some airflow to reach the 255W.

EDIT : Ripple value is 82 mV, not great but in spec.
https://www.artesyn.com/power/assets/trn_ac-dc_cps250-m_released_1_1501726912_techref.pdf (page 7).

It also features a Remote Inhibit function, you can use instead of a load switch.

Remote Inhibit - (Pin 3) Remote inhibit will require Pin 3 of J403 to be grounded to Pin2. Low voltage will also inhibit the power supply. Low is <0.8V and high is ≥2.0V, source current 1mA maximum. Left the inhibit pin open will enable the power supply.

 

[CARC Mini]

I've got the Artesyn in my Neutrino build works like a charm.

It's rated for 150W passive though, you'll need some airflow to reach the 255W.

EDIT : Ripple value is 82 mV, not great but in spec.
https://www.artesyn.com/power/assets/trn_ac-dc_cps250-m_released_1_1501726912_techref.pdf (page 7).

It also features a Remote Inhibit function, you can use instead of a load switch.

can you provide a load switch for me ??

 

[SilverJS]

I've got the Artesyn in my Neutrino build works like a charm.

It's rated for 150W passive though, you'll need some airflow to reach the 255W.

EDIT : Ripple value is 82 mV, not great but in spec.
https://www.artesyn.com/power/assets/trn_ac-dc_cps250-m_released_1_1501726912_techref.pdf (page 7).

It also features a Remote Inhibit function, you can use instead of a load switch.

Ok, cool! Glad to know that this particular unit has been used successfully, thanks for that! I'll read up on your build. Yes, I'll be cooling it - right now, plan is for me to be using a Noctua 40mmx10mm fan right next to it. Might actually need two due to the orientation I'll have to put them in, but I'm fairly certain I'll have the room for that.

With regards to the load switch function - very interesting!

Either way, I really think 250w will be enough. I just hope that, later down the line if I want more power, that the industry will have progressed and squeezed even more power in the 2"x4" space...

 

[aquelito]

can you provide a load switch for me ??

of course, i'll be willing to pay for it.

Unfortunately the load switch is out of stock. I may launch a new batch but it'll require some redesign as the main component is now obsolete.

With regards to the load switch function - very interesting!

I also had that that small PCB made : it allows you to control the PS_ON function of the Meanwell PSUs with your momentary switch !
Which means you no longer need load switches.
Unfortunately I haven't been able to get it to work...
Will see if we can make a second protoype.