Help for quiet SFF build

[FredT]

Hello everyone

I would like to build my first SFF mostly for gaming but also office and photo editing

Here the components I might go for :

Case : NCASE M1 (waiting for the m6?)
CPU : Intel Core i7-9700/9700K or i9-9900/9900K
MOBO : ASUS Strix Z370-I or Z390-I
RAM : Corsair LPX 2x16GB @2400 (16 enough but why not)
GPU : EVGA RTX 2070 XC Black Edition Gaming 8GB (any others?)
SSD : Samsung 970 Evo Plus M.2 1TB
PSU : Corsair SF600 Platinum

My main questions are for the cooling part, which ones to choose to have the best noise/cooling efficiency ?
(Dumb question, can we have one AIO for the CPU and GPU ?)

Will it make a big difference to go for 65W version of the CPU instead of the 95W ?

I might downsize one or two things but I would like to keep it as is for the next 3-5 years

Thanks a lot for your help

Fred

 

[LeChuck81]

If you don't mount the GPU vertically, there's plenty of room for a 240mm AiO CPU cooler. That aside, I can't find any evidence of a 65 W version of the 9700K, aka the 9700.
I do not doubt though it will eventually be released and it will have 65 W TDP. The difference between the two, as usual per non-K vs K variant of Intel's CPU, will be what you can and can not overclock. The K variant is the unlocked version, you can overclock frequency, multiplier and something else I can't remember right now. In the non-K variant the frequency is locked(?) and there's a limited range of multiplier compared to K variant.
If you go for an AiO solution, and budget is not a major concern, I'd go for the K variant. But I'd settle for the 9700K, heard the 9900K is a hard one to cool.
As for the GPU, given the limited space, I'd go for a blower one. Almost any producer has at least one blower variant in their catalogues. At least when Nvidia is involved.

 

[FredT]

Thanks for your reply

I saw that on Youtube :
2x120mm AiO, one for the CPU and one for the GPU

I think he combined an EVGA Hybrid kit and one Corsair CPU water cooler
I'm not sur if it's "noisy" or not... And also, will they cool enough all the components

Also, what about the wiring ? Do you have any advice ? brand, length etc

 

[LeChuck81]

Thanks for your reply

I saw that on Youtube :
2x120mm AiO, one for the CPU and one for the GPU

I think he combined an EVGA Hybrid kit and one Corsair CPU water cooler
I'm not sur if it's "noisy" or not... And also, will they cool enough all the components

A few days ago I saw this video from LinusTechTips



comparing a couple Noctua air coolers with AiOs.
The biggest AiOs were on par (not topping) the NH-U12A while the smaller ones were the less performing ones.
Good thing about the (best) AiOs was they were faster to bring temps down.

About noise.
I have yet to build a SFF, my current rig is in a MasterCase Maker 5, different spaces, different noise suppression.
I also have a MasterLiquid Pro 240 in it, which is doing its job at keeping fresh an OC'd i7 2600K@4.5 GHz.
Lately, after a periodic cleaning of the case, the AiO started vibrating. Maybe it's a screw, not really sure, haven't looked into it yet.
Anyway, before this little problem, I was satisfied with the noise level. That said, I'm not particularly obsessed with noise, I usually play with headphones.

Also, what about the wiring ? Do you have any advice ? brand, length etc

Sorry, haven't digged into it yet, I'm using the ones provided with MoBo and PSU (a Corsair AX760i).
But with my next two projects (shrinking my current system into an SFF and building a new one into a Sentry 2.0) I will look into it.

 

[Revenant]

Suggestions for your build:

9900K at stock setting.

32GB of DDR4-3200 not 2400. XMP OFF.

NZXT X52 AIO with Noctua Sterrox fans set as intake under the radiator. Set for 50% fan speed and increase if the CPU EXCEEDS 85C under AVX load. Set pump to quiet mode.

Alternately, get a Noctua C14S if you’re not going to overclock.

2 additional NOCTUA sterrox fans under the GPU. Set them to 800 RPM as intakes.

A single 92mm exhaust on the back of the case. Set for about 50% speed.

The Corsair 600 Platinum is the quietest SFX PSU.

Get long cables and move the system away from you.

The vast majority of M1 noise comes from the CPU (left) side.

 

[fabio]

Suggestions for your build:

9900K at stock setting.

32GB of DDR4-3200 not 2400. XMP OFF.

NZXT X52 AIO with Noctua Sterrox fans set as intake under the radiator. Set for 50% fan speed and increase if the CPU EXCEEDS 85C under AVX load. Set pump to quiet mode.

Alternately, get a Noctua C14S if you’re not going to overclock.

2 additional NOCTUA sterrox fans under the GPU. Set them to 800 RPM as intakes.

A single 92mm exhaust on the back of the case. Set for about 50% speed.

The Corsair 600 Platinum is the quietest SFX PSU.

Get long cables and move the system away from you.

The vast majority of M1 noise comes from the CPU (left) side.

I think this is the only DDR4 3200Mhz JEDEC speed WITHOUT XMP!
https://www.kingston.com/dataSheets/HX432C18FBK2_32.pdf

I suggest the Noctua U9s, especially with the 9900K at stock speed!

 

[TheHig]

One can manually input the XMP listed timings and ram voltage without setting XMP to on in bios. That way you get your ram speed and the mobo leaves the cpu alone

 

[Revenant]

One can manually input the XMP listed timings and ram voltage without setting XMP to on in bios. That way you get your ram speed and the mobo leaves the cpu alone

What he said...

 

[FredT]

Thanks everyone !

I think I'll go full air as I'm afraid the pump noise will annoy me....

Final choice :
Case : NCASE M1 v6
CPU : Intel Core i9-9900K
MOBO : ASUS Strix Z390-I
RAM : HyperX Fury 2x16GB @3200
GPU : EVGA RTX 2070 XC Black Edition Gaming 8GB
SSD : Samsung 970 Evo M.2 1TB
PSU : Corsair SF600 Platinum
CPU cooler : Noctua U9S
Under GPU fans : 2 Noctua NF-A12x25 PWM
Back exhaust fan : Noctua NF-A9 PWM

Just waiting for the price inquiry I made and of course the new Ncase

 

[LeChuck81]

May I?
I understand it will be a gaming rig.
Do you really need the 8 added threads, the 0.1 more GHz and the added 4 MB of L3 cache of the i9 vs the i7?
Consider all of that will cost you something around 100$. Which you can spend somewhere else. Or bank it.

 

[FredT]

To be honest no... I'm sure I will not see the difference between them

I also asked for a pricing with the 9700k and depending of the price difference, I'll choose accordingly

I'm also looking for a frameless monitor and the extra 100 will help a lot for sure but if there is "only" 40$ difference, I'll go with 9900k

It will also depends on the price that I'll be able to get from my current config (all for my friend)...

 

[LeChuck81]

Indeed, if the difference is 40$, I'm totally with you.
But MSRP is 488$ vs 374$, unless you get a really good price on the i9, I don't expect the difference between the two being significantly different than ~100$

 

[FredT]

At the end I’ll stay with 9700k, 90+ difference

Quick question, I can have the EVGA RTX 2070 XC Gaming (08G-P4-2172-KR) for 25$ less than the EVGA RTX 2070 XC Black Edition Gaming (08G-P4-1171-KR)
Looking at EVGA website it should be the opposite
Is there really a difference ?

If I can get a bit more for less I’m happy with that

 

[Revenant]

I'm going to strongly advise against just going with the 9700K. The same argument was made against the 2600K vs the 2500K back in the day. The 2600K is still a viable CPU due to the hyperthreading whereas the 2500K is crushed by modern dual cores now. I know this first hand because I bought one of each, and have been kicking myself for years for saving the $100 and not getting two 2600Ks. It's the same reason a 3770K can still play modern games while a 3550k is all but forgotten. Moreover, next gen gaming consoles will support 16 threads, and you better believe developers will begin using them.

I'm certain the 9700K will do fine for 2 to 3 years, but at that point if you're looking to save cash just drop down the i7-8700 non-k for $300 and call it a day.

Take a few minutes and watch these videos before you decide.

 

[Thehack]

Ryze 3000 series is a month away. Might as well wait for benchmarks and then make the decision.

HT is essentially an Intel ripoff anyways. The chips and yields are the same. Difference is just a fuse you pay $100 to not cut. At least with AMD you get more functional cores and better bin. It kind of irks me this happens.

 

[Revenant]

Ryze 3000 series is a month away. Might as well wait for benchmarks and then make the decision.

HT is essentially an Intel ripoff anyways. The chips and yields are the same. Difference is just a fuse you pay $100 to not cut. At least with AMD you get more functional cores and better bin. It kind of irks me this happens.

I agree that he should wait and look at Ryzen 3000 series. I disagree on the rip off. While Intel has certainly overcharged a premium for it, it does have real world benefits.

Neither company is good, neither company is evil. They are solely there to make money. I have no brand loyalty for either company. Both, have had their good products and their rip offs.AMD is currently putting market pressure back on Intel. That is very good for us as consumers. But don’t think for one second, that had the rolls been reversed, AMD would be exactly where Intel is.

 

[Thehack]

I agree that he should wait and look at Ryzen 3000 series. I disagree on the rip off. While Intel has certainly overcharged a premium for it, it does have real world benefits.

Neither company is good, neither company is evil. They are solely there to make money. I have no brand loyalty for either company. Both, have had their good products and their rip offs.AMD is currently putting market pressure back on Intel. That is very good for us as consumers. But don’t think for one second, that had the rolls been reversed, AMD would be exactly where Intel is.

There is a spectrum of where a company stands ethically. If we were to reduce a company to say they were only designed to make money would be a disservice to the many smart and talented engineers out there that greatly contributed to the technological progress.

It's a fools errand to speculate what ifs. I find Amd have greatly contribute more. Maybe they will be the bully in the alternate universe, but that does not change the sour taste of overpaying for HT. Nowadays it comes to light that their implementation was security cutting. Nevermind the days of ivy Bridge "free" HT xeons being used on regular chipsets getting disabled as soon as intel found people were buying it instead of their i7 line. And I'm not too happy of the recent security flaws killing my notebook performance. Real world benefits...

I haven't seen the 8700k significantly cheaper than the 9700k. I vote for real cores over HT and solder over TIM if the price is close.

 

[Revenant]

There is a spectrum of where a company stands ethically. If we were to reduce a company to say they were only designed to make money would be a disservice to the many smart and talented engineers out there that greatly contributed to the technological progress.

It's a fools errand to speculate what ifs. I find Amd have greatly contribute more. Maybe they will be the bully in the alternate universe, but that does not change the sour taste of overpaying for HT. Nowadays it comes to light that their implementation was security cutting. Nevermind the days of ivy Bridge "free" HT xeons being used on regular chipsets getting disabled as soon as intel found people were buying it instead of their i7 line. And I'm not too happy of the recent security flaws killing my notebook performance. Real world benefits...

I haven't seen the 8700k significantly cheaper than the 9700k. I vote for real cores over HT and solder over TIM if the price is close.

I suggest the 8700. Not the 8700K. $280, lower power threshold, and still boosts to 4.3ghz. 12 threads. I have one and it games well.

You’re clearly a fan of AMD. I don’t mean that in a bad way. You have your reasons. I don’t like either company and pray for the a third option. AMD is hardly innocent though. Anyone with a few moments of idle curiosity can easily find their own examples starting with tremendously deceitful marketing of the K6 and 3DNOW.

Companies loose any ethics as soon as they become public. By case law, they must do anything and everything to raise the short term gains of the shareholders. Both Intel and AMD are public. Both are beholden to rip-off, cut benefits, and do whatever possible to increase dividends. Any engineer that has loyalty to that probably built their house on sand.

As far as security cutting, AMD was also hit by meltdown and specter. The patches lost about 3% in 99% of use cases, games Included. I bring this up to say simply that he won’t loose much from a primary gaming build.

I still agree with you though that it would be wise to wait for Ryzen 3000 series benchmarks.

Any further discussion not related to his system though I invite you to PM me so we don’t take the thread off rails.

 

[FredT]

Ryze 3000 series is a month away. Might as well wait for benchmarks and then make the decision.

Indeed I should wait especially as I'm waiting also for the NCASE
I'm use to buy/use Intel, and to be honest AMD didn't cross my mind ...

 

[Revenant]

Indeed I should wait especially as I'm waiting also for the NCASE
I'm use to buy/use Intel, and to be honest AMD didn't cross my mind ...

It will certainly be interesting. The 12 Core model, depending upon power and heat, might be the new go-to CPU. AMD tends to be more accurate with their TDP ratings so I think it will be doable. Man....if the claims ring true I'll be hard pressed not to upgrade my main system to it on coolness factor alone. I currently have an 8086K in at 5GHZ that I really have no complaints about other than the heat....but 12 Cores...24 Threads.... That would be some fun there.