Concept 730 Systems: "Ether" (12.95L) and "Serum" (15.75L) SFF ITX Cases.

[Boil]

Why do you feel the need to roll up in others threads & shitte all over them...?

Because most of SFF cases is copy paste. All want create own case, but do not add something really new. I told previously - create case for both air and water it's utopia.

So you see a chassis that does not fall into your particular idea of the perfect SFF chassis & you think posting negative comments in a random thread is the solution...?

I think part of the problem (aside from your arrogance & superior attitude) may be that English is not your native tongue...?

Why do you feel the need to demand modifications to others chassis designs to fit your needs...?

I promoting new ways.

You are promoting the fact that you are being an arsehole more than anything...

If you want to promote new ways, then at least sketch them out & create your own thread, just rolling thru a thread and telling OP they are doing it all wrong is not productive...

Why do you feel the need to act as if you know best in regards to water cooling requirements...?

Just because. I use water for cooling. I create custom waterloop in SFF cases and has a lot of experience in this

Fair enough, but since you say you build "custom waterloop" in SFF chassis, you know the smaller you go the more compromises are made...

Maybe rather than naysaying the hard work of others across multiple threads you devote your time to learning some CAD software & designing YOUR perfect chassis...!?!

I don't have time for it and resources. I can buy such case.

So maybe just going into a thread and DEMANDING CHANGES, you try finding a chassis designer that vibes with whatever aesthetic you prefer & message them about custom work...?

Which would require more from you than just typing up a vague text-based version of what is your perfect SFF chassis; sketches, dimensions, renderings, things like that...

What most compact - air cooled gpu or gpu with waterblock? There is more SFF religion?

There is no perfect all around SFF chassis; compromises are made for size, for air-cooling, for water cooling, for a lot of reasons...

Traditional definition of SFF is 20L or less, but there are those who feel the urge to be at the top of the leaderboards for PPL (Performance Per Liter), so the smaller the chassis the better...

uSFF (ultra Small Form Factor) cases, usually 10L or less (but the uSFF extremists will say 5L OR DEATH!) really put a strain on what one might be comfortable with to call acceptable cooling (but that could change in the next few years with more powerful APUs on the horizon) ; and a dual rad custom loop can sometimes suffer dimension creep when one wants to stuff more in the chassis (yet still have proper breathing room for actual airflow in & out of the chassis...

@seven7thirty30, sorry to (ever so slightly) derail your thread, but I dig the Serum...!

 

[seven7thirty30]

This got out of hand pretty quickly, so I'll try to say a few words to get back on track. I want this case to standout from the rest, but I also want it to work for more than just the minority. I designed "Ether" for those that want a sub 13L air-cooled case that can handle the new Nvidia FE style coolers. I wanted to transition most of what was good about the "Ether" design into "Serum" for water cooling enthusiasts. There is a lot of give and take when coming up with the design for a case. This is my first time trying this, and I've already learned more than I thought I would. I'm prepared for the criticism/negative comments. I have to consider them and try to understand what is being said, even if it is being spat at me in a distasteful way. I'll take the positive out of this and keep going.

I have realized that the air chamber in "Ether" isn't necessary for "Serum". I can go without it and save valuable space that could be used to find a way to add a 2nd radiator without adding too much width. I'm in the process of hammering out a design that might prove to be viable.

I appreciate you all taking the time to say a few words. I really do.

 

[seven7thirty30]

Cool designs. I like the air chamber idea. My one concern is that the many tiny holes just arent enough for intake and exhaust. I think they will create too much restriction in either direction.

Thank you. I had the same concern that you do, but then I looked into similar cases and saw that they also use 3mm holes for ventilation (but with smaller spacing). I increased the size of the holes on both cases to 4mm in the hope that it will be enough. I definitely plan to re-evaluate it with a prototype.

 

[smalltownboi]

Wow.

Really like the idea of the flipped GPU setup in ether.

Have to say this is one of the most aesthetically pleasing designs.

Just a suggestion if you could make the side ventilation mimic the front cutout just to make the design homogenous. This would also make for larger ventilation holes aka better airflow.

Serum though for a complete water cooled build, I don't think the middle chamber is required. For people building a custom loop could afford to source custom cables to avoid the clutter. Maybe a proper pump mount would make the proposition much more pleasing to the custom loop aficionados.
I know this a heated topic in the thread right now. But I would go with any decision you take further.

Thanks man. Definitely will be keeping a close eye on this.

 

[seven7thirty30]

Wow.

Registered just to reply to you. When I saw the black and gold color choice, it made me feel that @seven7thirty30 knows what he is doing. Man you nailed with the color choice.

Really like the idea of the flipped GPU setup in ether.

Have to say this is one of the most aesthetically pleasing designs.

Just a suggestion if you could make the side ventilation mimic the front cutout just to make the design homogenous. This would also make for larger ventilation holes aka better airflow.

Serum though for a complete water cooled build, I don't think the middle chamber is required. For people building a custom loop could afford to source custom cables to avoid the clutter. Maybe a proper pump mount would make the proposition much more pleasing to the custom loop aficionados.
I know this a heated topic in the thread right now. But I would go with any decision you take further.

Thanks man. Definitely will be keeping a close eye on this.

Awesome, welcome to SFF Network! I appreciate that you took the time to reply here. Funny that you mentioned the side ventilation cutouts mirroring the front cutout because my very first design when this all started did exactly that. I have been debating whether or not I would use it again and now I will at least make a rendered image and post it here for you guys to see, soon.

I agree that the center air chamber isn't necessary for "Serum". I'm currently working on a redesign for that case to use that space more efficiently.

Part of the redesign will of course have pump/reservoir mounting holes in hopefully more than one area. It's a challenge because I want people to have options based on what's easily available to purchase.

 

[Phuncz]

MOD BREAK: please remain civil and respect eachother's point of view. Being confident in your opinion doesn't make it a fact. Learn to live in a community where every concept of what you think is the only truth will be challenged because it isn't the only truth.

My personal opinion on giving feedback on a case is if needs a complete redesign to support your wishes, you are not the intended customer. Maybe consider making a project yourself or look for another project that better suits your needs. Also, watercooling isn't a better way of cooling, as it still uses air to dissipate heat. The water in the system is to transfer heat to the air dissipation (radiator) and also acts as a buffer. Water cooling allows a more flexible use of cooling but also is much more complex, expensive, failure prone and requires more maintenance.

 

[THUMPer]

Looking at ether, where would the intake and exhaust case fans go?

 

[seven7thirty30]

Update: "Ether"

Reduced the amount of top/bottom shell mounting screws from 16 to 8. Changed the side and interior panel vents. Doesn't get anymore unrestrictive than this. 10mm in width...would make for a pretty easy way to take the case outside and hit with a can of air without having to open the case. Comments?

 

[seven7thirty30]

Looking at ether, where would the intake and exhaust case fans go?

So...theoretically Ether shouldn't need fans since the top and bottom shells are completely vented, and the side and interior vents are large. I don't want to add to the component fan noise (CPU cooler, PSU fan, and GPU cooler) that will already be noticeable. A good example is the S4M where the entire case is ventilated and it doesn't need fans for intake or exhaust. I will add mounting holes for 60mm (possibly 80mm..I'll have to evaluate) fans on the floor of the case for intake and at the top for exhaust just so that the option is there. Unfortunately, since each chamber is so thin already (about 75mm) larger fans wouldn't fit. If it turns out that the case definitely needs intake/exhaust fans, then I could try to extend the height by 15mm and add a bracket (similar to the one seen on "Serum") that could fit two slim 120mm or 140mm fans for exhaust. The same could be done for the bottom. I'll look into maybe creating a bottom extension that wouldn't be visible with the case feet on that could house a thin 120mm or 140mm fan for intake.

 

[THUMPer]

How well would a regular 2 or 3 fan GPU cool in this? I could see the benefit for the 3080 FE.

 

[seven7thirty30]

How well would a regular 2 or 3 fan GPU cool in this? I could see the benefit for the 3080 FE.

Considering that I don't have a prototype, yet, I can't say how well anything will cool in this case. My belief is that a 2 or 3 fan GPU will do just as well as the Nvidia FE design. It would have the same air to pull from and the same ventilation. The real benefit of this design is the isolation of the CPU and the GPU chambers. The vented air from each chamber "should" not affect the other. A 2 or 3 fan GPU like you're talking about wouldn't dump its' hot air all over the CPU and vice versa like they do in other cases.

Either way, when I have a prototype in hand I will be doing thorough testing with a variety of GPUs....IF I can even get an Nvidia 3000 series card.

 

[THUMPer]

The updated render looks real good! Good luck with your prototype.

 

[seven7thirty30]

Update: "Ether"

Added a few case comparison images to the first page of this thread.

 

[seven7thirty30]

Update: "Serum"

Added new renders for Serum to the first page of this thread.

I've decided to make "Serum" an AIO water cooling system compatible version of the "Ether" case. "Serum" is a work-station focused case that can also appeal to overclocking enthusiasts. The center air chamber will provide the cooling necessary for GPU's with a flow through design as seen in the Nvidia FE cards. I was also able to reduce the overall volume of the case by 1 liter.

The real question is would you rather;

Have a case like "Ether" (12.47L) that only supports air cooling with a compromise on CPU choice (due to the max 70mm CPU cooler height)?

or

Would you prefer "Serum" (15.47L) that supports an AIO water cooling system for the CPU without a compromise on CPU choice?

I haven't abandoned the idea of a SFF case that can support up to two 240/280mm radiators with a custom water cooling loop, and I'm currently in the process of designing one.

 

[SquareCubedBox]

Hello @seven7thirty30!
I'm fairly new to the forum and I would like to offer some general feedback as well despite being a total noob.

I love the idea that you have two separate cases that caters to an air-cooled focused build and a water-cooled focused build and I love that your goal right now is to improve on those designs and gather as much feedback as possible.

I have a suggestion that the space of the air chamber for the Serum can instead be used for an integrated distro-plate or squarish/rectangular reservoir with a slot (or two) for a D5/DDC pump, or a DC-LT2600/3600 pump from Alphacool. Also, I read on another thread (I think it's the WinterOne thread) that a 2 x 30mm thick radiator is more efficient than a 1 x 60mm thick radiator so you might want to keep that in mind while redesigning ?

Finally (this is more of a mentality advice haha), so that you can efficiently work on the design of the cases (esp the Serum one), you might want to stick on with your original designs and improving upon them based from feedback and eventual prototyping. Aside from the fact that your initial designs are so frikin' cool, it would be redundant to work on a 2 x 240/280 right now because there are already cases (such as the NCase, prototyped Dan C4, and the upcoming Winter One case) that can cater to such setups. And you already mentioned that you want your case to stand out and be unique from the others.

Keep up the good work man! I hope that this project eventually comes to fruition. The more designs, the better ??

 

[scatterforce]

Adding to what @SquareCubedBox said, I think Ether is a far more interesting case design. I love the square symmetrical look, the inside air chamber is unique and accommodates more types of GPUs. Furthermore, with 70mm of CPU cooler height, you can run a big CPU and a big GPU easily (by SFF standards).

I would consider cable routing; how the PSU is currently mounted would all but require custom cables. The 24 pin on the motherboard is so close to the PSU that any extra cable length will get in the way. I also love the slot design on the sides and would use a similar design to the top. Maybe it's just me, but I like cases with consistent ventilation patterns.

One last thought, to anyone: why include the vertical slots at the rear for the GPU? Why not make a big 3 slot opening for maximum exhaust? Even if a 2 slot card is installed, it would just allow for more airflow. (this might be a bad idea, but I'd love to hear some opinions on this one)

 

[seven7thirty30]

Hello @seven7thirty30!
I'm fairly new to the forum and I would like to offer some general feedback as well despite being a total noob.

I love the idea that you have two separate cases that caters to an air-cooled focused build and a water-cooled focused build and I love that your goal right now is to improve on those designs and gather as much feedback as possible.

I have a suggestion that the space of the air chamber for the Serum can instead be used for an integrated distro-plate or squarish/rectangular reservoir with a slot (or two) for a D5/DDC pump, or a DC-LT2600/3600 pump from Alphacool. Also, I read on another thread (I think it's the WinterOne thread) that a 2 x 30mm thick radiator is more efficient than a 1 x 60mm thick radiator so you might want to keep that in mind while redesigning ?

Finally (this is more of a mentality advice haha), so that you can efficiently work on the design of the cases (esp the Serum one), you might want to stick on with your original designs and improving upon them based from feedback and eventual prototyping. Aside from the fact that your initial designs are so frikin' cool, it would be redundant to work on a 2 x 240/280 right now because there are already cases (such as the NCase, prototyped Dan C4, and the upcoming Winter One case) that can cater to such setups. And you already mentioned that you want your case to stand out and be unique from the others.

Keep up the good work man! I hope that this project eventually comes to fruition. The more designs, the better ??

Thanks for your feedback! I'm with you on the distro plate idea. I was working on trying to design one that would occupy the middle chamber with pump mounting options and an LED to light it up too. It would be the perfect space for one and would be unique. I also agree with you about the 30mm radiator vs a 45+ radiator. Thanks for your support!

 

[seven7thirty30]

Adding to what @SquareCubedBox said, I think Ether is a far more interesting case design. I love the square symmetrical look, the inside air chamber is unique and accommodates more types of GPUs. Furthermore, with 70mm of CPU cooler height, you can run a big CPU and a big GPU easily (by SFF standards).

I would consider cable routing; how the PSU is currently mounted would all but require custom cables. The 24 pin on the motherboard is so close to the PSU that any extra cable length will get in the way. I also love the slot design on the sides and would use a similar design to the top. Maybe it's just me, but I like cases with consistent ventilation patterns.

One last thought, to anyone: why include the vertical slots at the rear for the GPU? Why not make a big 3 slot opening for maximum exhaust? Even if a 2 slot card is installed, it would just allow for more airflow. (this might be a bad idea, but I'd love to hear some opinions on this one)

Thanks for taking the time to post. I agree that a 70mm CPU cooler is a pretty good size for SFF builds. I currently use a Black Ridge cooler in my S4M and I'm pretty impressed with the thermals. I put a lot of thought into cable routing and came to the conclusion that most people with SFF builds go with custom length cables so I wouldn't imagine them going without them in this case. With "Ether" I moved the PSU closer to the side panel to provide space behind it to hide some cables. There is space in "Serum" as well, behind the PSU, but not as much. Also the top and bottom spines of the case are hollow and cables can be hidden in there as well. I don't have an answer for you about the GPU slots. I honestly wouldn't care either way, but I'm sure some people do.

 

[scatterforce]

Thanks for taking the time to post. I agree that a 70mm CPU cooler is a pretty good size for SFF builds. I currently use a Black Ridge cooler in my S4M and I'm pretty impressed with the thermals. I put a lot of thought into cable routing and came to the conclusion that most people with SFF builds go with custom length cables so I wouldn't imagine them going without them in this case. With "Ether" I moved the PSU closer to the side panel to provide space behind it to hide some cables. There is space in "Serum" as well, behind the PSU, but not as much. Also the top and bottom spines of the case are hollow and cables can be hidden in there as well. I don't have an answer for you about the GPU slots. I honestly wouldn't care either way, but I'm sure some people do.

Space behind the PSU is a great thing! Pushing the intake fan right next to the panel would also help avoid the PSU recirculating it's own exhaust.

It's clear you've put a lot of thought into this. I do worry about cost; sometimes, there are reasons why things haven't been done this way before. Reducing the screw count as you have done will certainly help. I hope to see this become a reality someday.

 

[Kundahli]

Does the center channel open on top to allow air pushed into it to exhaust from the top or is it only open from the front and back? If the latter, I suspect it will create a bit of a a hot air dead zone.