Log SFFTIME U-ITX : 7 Liters to tame the R7 9800X3D and the RTX 4080 FE!

[MarcParis]

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SFFTIME U-ITX : A new Odyssey starts : 7 Liters to tame the AMD R7 9800X3D and the NVIDIA RTX 4080 FE (29th December 2024)
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My interest in this case project from @riba2233 started when I noticed & tried the Minisforum BD790i, at the very beginning of 2024!
Finally I went with the FormD T1 for this build, a good one but not the mesmerizing one I was looking for.

A little bit later, I built again inside my beloved Cerberus-X a new setup based on AM5 and the excellent AMD R7 9800X3D!

The Cerberus-X demonstrated, once again, its polyvalence as I spent a lot of time benchmarking this setup. The overall conclusion was simple : the R7 9800X3D is very fast but tends to be power hungry (and distracting loud) if it is not tamed. Thus I tested several ways to undervolt/underclock it, aiming for its best efficiency. I even tested the ID Cooling IS-47-XT 47mm tall cpu cooler, versus the Noctua C14S and D12L!

That’s when @riba2233 informed me that the U-ITX was finally available and already on its way!
The stars were aligned!

NON FUNCTIONAL PROTOTYPE BUILD

Before investing into a new motherboard I decided to build a first prototype based on my only remaining working mini ITX MB using an ultra modern A10-5700K coupled with a legendary prolimatech samuel 17..







Comparison versus my N-ATX v2






Here are shorts remarks based on the initial prototype

• The U-ITX assembly was smooth and straight forward. I noted several improvements versus the N-ATX v2 :
  • The U-ITX is offering fully independent side panels with its stand! On the N-ATX, if you want to use the stand, you have to use both side panels.
  • The bracket to secure the GPU on the U-ITX is independent of the GPU. On the N-ATX you have to assemble a small bracket on the GPU itself
  • The PSU assembly is way easier in the U-ITX compared to the N-ATX
• The U-ITX seems not compatible with the motherboard rear i/o shield
• The U-ITX is very light (less than 1kg). However all parts are reinforcing its structure.
• To fit my RTX 4080 FE I had to disassemble the screws of the front panel, located at the bottom (x2)/middle (x1), but at the top. The front panel offers very good flexibility to allow enough offset to insert the RTX 4080 FE.
• Dislike the FormD T1, the U-ITX handling manual is accurate & effective. The GPU insertion requires to couple the GPU with its riser and only then to assemble it inside the case.
• There is tight clearance between the bottom/right motherboard screw and the GPU power connector. Be careful on some mini ITX motherboard compatibility like the Aorus X870i (PCIe unlocking system)
• The U-ITX, like the N-ATX, offers 2 setups to fix the PSU extension cable : internal plug or external pigtail (like on my Sliger SM550). I’m not fond of the external solution.
• Cable management promises to be challenging..

Based on this initial test, I decided to buy an AM5 mini ITX motherboard. After some headaches, I went to a second hand Asus B650E-I model : good price, not too bulky, PCIe gen 5, 10 & 20GBps type-C at the rear.

FUNCTIONAL TEST BUILD

Here is the summary of the part I selected for this build :

• CPU : AMD Ryzen 7 9800X3D PBO PPT 95W, Curve Shaper :
  • Min Frequencies : -30
  • Low Frequencies : -30
  • Med Frequencies : -30 (Max Threads performance, like Cinebench)
  • High Frequencies : -10 (Gaming)
  • Max Frequencies : -10
• Motherboard : ROG STRIX B650E-I GAMING WIFI (without rear i/o shield and plastic cover)
• CPU Cooling :
  • Heatsink : ID Cooling IS-47-XT, black (2 orientations for AM5 is a great feature. Way better mounting system compared to Thermalright). Vertical fin orientation selected.
  • Cooling fan : Fan replaced by a Noctua NF-A9x14 HS-PWM chromax.black.swap (2500 rpm)
  • Thermal paste : Arctic MX-6
  • Contact frame : Not yet, but Thermal Grizzly will be considered
• RAM : Corsair Vengeance 2x24Go 7600 MTS (XMP profile worked well with this motherboard versus my MSI X870 Tomahawk). Booting stime is also excellent, especially versus my MSI X870 Tomahawk (pleasant surprise)
• GPU : NVIDIA RTX 4080 FE
• PSU : Corsair SF1000 with its standard cables. (Not using custom cables remains a very nice & unexpected surprise!). Cherry on the top : I can use the internal power plug (no external pigtail)
• SSD#1 : AData SX8200 Pro 2To (Gen 3)
• SSD#2 : To come
• UPS : USB connection to UPS is fully functional versus with my MSI X870 Tomahawk

Here are the photos!
I love this serial number


With the i/o shield & plastic cover, the motherboard does not align properly with fixing points



Fortunately the rear i/o shield and the plastic cover are easy to remove (2+3 screws). I kept fan grid in the final assembly



Ready to receive the GPU!


Surprisingly easily done!




With the back & front panels..and the stand assembled, time to test!


Testing potential air turbulences


When all tests were positive, I decided to measure the PSU & GPU cables I needed to order…but, in the end, it was not necessary! I managed to improve my cable management significantly to be able to close the side panel! I even have full access to the CPU cooler and the SSDs!




Here is the final result!






CONCLUSION
This U-ITX setup reminds me in many ways of my beloved NFC S4 Mini one, back to 2016!
Hopefully, since the 2016 NFC S4 mini, the U-ITX can take advantage of several major improvements :

• No need of external PSU (nor custom cables)
• Compatible with big GPU, like the NVIDIA RTX 4080 FE
• CPU are now way more efficient and easier to tame (thanks to PBO) compared to 2016
• Overall way more powerful & quiet

Put it in a simple way, I consider the U-ITX as a worthy heir of the NFC S4 mini!
I’m loving this SFFTIME U-ITX!

I’ll continue my testing inside the U-ITX and let you know!

Thanks again for @riba2233 !

 

[rfarmer]

Great build, the picture showing your serial number isn't loading. I recently did a build in the FormD T1 and while I love the case I agree the manual is crap.

 

[MarcParis]

Great build, the picture showing your serial number isn't loading. I recently did a build in the FormD T1 and while I love the case I agree the manual is crap.

2xThanks..link fixed..

 

[riba2233]

Hi,

Thanks for the detailed write-up, I really appreciate it! Glad you like the case

Build looks great and good job with that cable management, I know that it is not easy haha.

I designed clearance for the IO shield same as on P-ATX but tolerances might be a bit different so I will do one small modification for next batches, thanks for noticing it.

 

[MarcParis]

Hi,

Thanks for the detailed write-up, I really appreciate it! Glad you like the case

Build looks great and good job with that cable management, I know that it is not easy haha.

I designed clearance for the IO shield same as on P-ATX but tolerances might be a bit different so I will do one small modification for next batches, thanks for noticing it.

Hi @riba2233

My pleasure!
Np.

Let me know if you would have updated parts to test.

I should be able to share the performance level by this week end.

 

[MarcParis]

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SFFTIME U-ITX : Cooling & noise performance (04th January 2025)
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Time to test the U-ITX cooling capabilities!

AMD RYZEN 7 9800X3D Cooling

I must admit I was not expecting so many gaps between the two motherboards I’m using :

• ATX - MSI MAG X870 TOMAHAWK WIFI
• MINI ITX - ROG STRIX B650E-I GAMING WIFI

Definitively the Asus Bios is richer compared to the MSI

• Better RAM compatibility : my DDR5 Corsair Vengeance kit (2x24Go 7600MTS) worked fine (tweaked EXPO profile) and it is noticeably faster to boot
• VRM fan : can be disabled (done it)
• USB power : By default, USB ports are powered when the system is shut down. You can adjust it on the Asus. On the MSI, USB ports are off when system is shut down…and I did not find a way to toggle it
• Asus bios is saving properly PBO settings within profile, not MSI (most probably a current bug)
• My UPS through an usb connection is well supported by the Asus board, but not by the MSI, leading to repeated & temporary freezes

Overall I prefer my experience with the Asus B650E-I compared to the MSI X870 Tomahawk, however, it is not a deal breaker. Both motherboards are good.

What was not expected was their different behaviours on the PBO management. Even with identical setup I get different results on IBT 2.54 or Cinebench 2024.




Basically, the difference is on the Curve shaper application. As a reminder I’m applying -30 offset for min/low & medium frequencies and -10 on high/max frequencies. On the MSI I’m able to benefit from the -30 offset on CPU intensive workload, however the Asus board seems to apply only the -10 offset.

I would need to redo all my testing on the Asus motherboard, but it would be for another day..

As a conclusion, on pure CPU workload, the SFFTIME U-ITX paired with the ID Cooling IS-47-XT heatsink + the Noctua NF-A9x14 HS-PWM chromax.black.swap is capable to cool the AMD Ryzen 7 9800 X3D at the advertised TDP of 95W without any thermal throttling. BUT it is really noisy as the fan is spinning at around 2700 rpm.

For acceptable noise level, my recommendation is to limit the TDP to 75W, still no thermal throttle but the fan is sitting at around 1500 rpm and the CPU temperature around 85°C.

Please note I’ve applied the Thermal Grizzly AM5 contact frame with no issue.




NVIDIA RTX 4080 FE Cooling

In fact cooling the RTX 4080 FE is a non-issue...however the main issue remains the noise.

Basically the SFFTIME U-ITX is less effective on the GPU cooling due to the following points :

• Compared to the Cerberus-X & N-ATX v2, the rear fan of my RTX 4080 FE is approx 40% obstructed.
  
• Due to its small size, the GPU is receiving additional heat to dissipate from :
  • The CPU exhaust
  • The case itself as it is warming up

Overall this is leading to a 3-5°C GPU temperature increase versus Cerberus-X/N-ATX but, most importantly, GPU fan speed increase of +300rpm/+27% versus the Cerberus-X.

At the end, the RTX 4080 FE fans are reaching 1400 rpm, leading to a strong distracting noise.

Here is an example : R7 9800X3D @95W and Stock RTX 4080 FE vs Dragon Age : the Veilguard

• The AMD R7 9800 X3D @95W is almost permanently thermal throttling (~93-95°C) with a fan speed of 2000 rpm⇒non effective and too noisy
• The NVIDIA RTX 4080 FE is reaching up to 65°C with a fan speed of 1400 rpm

Here is another example : R7 9800X3D @65W and Stock RTX 4080 FE vs Dragon Age : the Veilguard

• The AMD R7 9800 X3D @65W is not thermal throttling (~81°C) with a fan speed of 1300 rpm ⇒ very effective cooling & quiet
• The NVIDIA RTX 4080 FE is reaching up to 63°C with a fan speed of 1400 rpm, still

Thus, I decided to control my RTX 4080 FE fans speed with MSI afterburner (4.6.6).
Target was to keep fanless mode on idle and 1100 rpm during load. Here is the final setup


Here is the final setup : R7 9800X3D @75W and RTX 4080 FE @1100RPM vs Dragon Age : the Veilguard

• The AMD R7 9800 X3D @75W is not thermal throttling (~88°C) with a fan speed of 1600 rpm ⇒ effective cooling & quiet
• The NVIDIA RTX 4080 FE is reaching up to 73°C (~260W) with a locked fan speed of 1100 rpm⇒ This is quiet gaming but the GPU temperature took a +12°C hit versus the Cerberus-X

Locking the GPU fan speed at 1100rpm is very effective due to the oversized heatsink of the RTX 4080 FE. But I wanted to know if the cooling potential was enough for higher GPU load.

Another test : R7 9800X3D @75W and RTX 4080 FE @1100RPM vs Star Wars : Outlaws (300W GPU load)

• The AMD R7 9800 X3D @75W is not used completely, sitting at 60W / 81°C with a fan speed of 1300 rpm ⇒ very effective cooling & quiet
• The NVIDIA RTX 4080 FE is reaching up to 75°C (~300W) with a locked fan speed of 1100 rpm ⇒ Successful

Last test : R7 9800X3D @75W and RTX 4080 FE @1100RPM vs Dragon’s Dogma 2

• The AMD R7 9800 X3D @75W could be used completely, 75W / 86°C with a fan speed of 1550 rpm ⇒ effective cooling & quiet
• The NVIDIA RTX 4080 FE is reaching up to 66°C (~230W) with no noticeable CPU bound issues with a locked fan speed of 1100 rpm ⇒ Successful

CONCLUSION

Each game has different CPU & GPU workloads, thus it is not so easy to state that my setup of an AMD R7 9800 X3d @75W + NVIDIA RTX 4080 FE @1100rpm will handle all of them without any issue.
Overall I’m really glad of the compromise.

Still I have some homeworks to do, especially on the back SSD temperature, i.e. 57°C idle and 70°C during gaming load as it is taking some exhaust hot air from the GPU.

PS : Please note that during idle/low GPU load, fanless mode is not eternal. From time to time, fans are starting up but are shutting down quickly after. The main difference versus the Cerberus-X is that there are no case fans permanently pointed towards the GPU. Even if those cases are spinning at very low RPM (500rpm) they are creating an airflow, enough to sustain GPU fanless mode forever.

 

[hrh_ginsterbusch]

As a reminder I’m applying -30 offset for min/low & medium frequencies and -10 on high/max frequencies. On the MSI I’m able to benefit from the -30 offset on CPU intensive workload, however the Asus board seems to apply only the -10 offset.

So its "ASUSified" (q. Techno Jesus), as usual?

cu, w0lf.

 

[MarcParis]

So its "ASUSified" (q. Techno Jesus), as usual?

cu, w0lf.

Well no. This Curve shape was found using my MSI board. I just carried over the same parameters on my Asus board. But behaviour is slightly different.