I'll be documenting my build log in this thread, mostly for people interested in NCASE M1 watercooling builds & component compatibility.
[edit] Pictures in post #3
Step 1 - component selection:
Brief
The plan is to build a fully featured all AMD ITX build, with adequate cooling (temperatures here in Cairns summer are 30-40° C) and low noise.
Why AMD? Besides being an AMD fanboy, their Zen 2 (Ryzen 3rd gen) CPU's beat everything hands down - this will be used for mixed workload, not just gaming.
For GPU's, I will be going Radeon because of their support for open source graphics drivers. The current state of Windows 10 is basically malware at this point (plenty of references can be provided!), and I now use Linux exclusively for both gaming and work. Gaming support is great, and with Google Stadia and Valve/Steam Proton it's only getting better.
The GPU target is High/Ultra settings at 3440x1440, at a minimum average of 60 FPS.
I hope this has been an interesting and/or informative post. Stay tuned for more info and PICTURES!
[edit] Pictures in post #3
Step 1 - component selection:
Brief
The plan is to build a fully featured all AMD ITX build, with adequate cooling (temperatures here in Cairns summer are 30-40° C) and low noise.
Why AMD? Besides being an AMD fanboy, their Zen 2 (Ryzen 3rd gen) CPU's beat everything hands down - this will be used for mixed workload, not just gaming.
For GPU's, I will be going Radeon because of their support for open source graphics drivers. The current state of Windows 10 is basically malware at this point (plenty of references can be provided!), and I now use Linux exclusively for both gaming and work. Gaming support is great, and with Google Stadia and Valve/Steam Proton it's only getting better.
The GPU target is High/Ultra settings at 3440x1440, at a minimum average of 60 FPS.
I'd been eyeing up this case since V5, as the most compact case on the market without making any major compromises. Initially I had designed my own case, but manufacturing to a decent quality is tricky and/or expensive if you're not already setup for sheet metal work. Thanks to Necere and his amazing work, the M1 turned out to be the best option by far.
Cooling/airflow is always a problem in ITX builds so the ability to use 2 decent sized radiators without trying to accommodate every possible component combination is perfect - to the point I would consider any other case less than perfect ?
Cooling/airflow is always a problem in ITX builds so the ability to use 2 decent sized radiators without trying to accommodate every possible component combination is perfect - to the point I would consider any other case less than perfect ?
There's really only 4 X570 SFF options available, and I considered the ASUS ROG DTX board for a while. However, to even have a remote chance at using a bottom radiator I would have to use the 140mm mounting slots on one side only (which just irks my OCD), and I couldn't justify the $750 price tag for crazy overclocking features I would never use.
It's also pretty well established that the M.2/Chipset cooling configuration on the Gigabyte board is not great, which only left 2 options.
Since a big requirement is SPDIF/Optical audio out, the ASRock board was the only logical choice for me.
However if you don't need Optical out, the ASUS Strix X570-I is the better board - mostly because of M.2 placement and cooler.
It's also pretty well established that the M.2/Chipset cooling configuration on the Gigabyte board is not great, which only left 2 options.
Since a big requirement is SPDIF/Optical audio out, the ASRock board was the only logical choice for me.
However if you don't need Optical out, the ASUS Strix X570-I is the better board - mostly because of M.2 placement and cooler.
For my use case, 8 cores/16 threads is the sweet spot (also slightly OCD about 6 cores ?), which leaves 2 options - the 3700X and 3800X.
Besides the value comparison with 3800X being a higher-binned CPU, the 65W TDP is a great fit for a compact build. In practice this is actually 80-90W, but is still 5-10W less that the 3800X.
Even though I will have 2 radiators, they will be operating with 15mm fans at low RPM, so the less power the better as long as I'm not making massive compromises.
Not to mention the 3700X is not just 'good enough' - it outperforms almost all of Intel's line up in both single and multi-thread performance!
Note: I've put 'TBC' just in case an 8 core APU is announced at CES in January - this would give me the option of GPU pass-through to a virtual machine.
Besides the value comparison with 3800X being a higher-binned CPU, the 65W TDP is a great fit for a compact build. In practice this is actually 80-90W, but is still 5-10W less that the 3800X.
Even though I will have 2 radiators, they will be operating with 15mm fans at low RPM, so the less power the better as long as I'm not making massive compromises.
Not to mention the 3700X is not just 'good enough' - it outperforms almost all of Intel's line up in both single and multi-thread performance!
Note: I've put 'TBC' just in case an 8 core APU is announced at CES in January - this would give me the option of GPU pass-through to a virtual machine.
Obviously the 5700 XT is the most powerful AMD Navi card available, and since I will be water cooling the GPU, the reference design is the best option.
According to Buildzoid the reference PCB is a very over-engineered design, which is encouraging.
Most of the aftermarket designs also extend too high above the PCI slot, not leaving room for the waterblock fittings/hoses.
Not only is the Sapphire reference card the cheapest available, they also have a history of producing some of the best AMD cards.
Note: I've put 'TBC' in the hopes that AMD announces a more powerful card at CES in January - although the 5700 XT meets my performance target, it does it just barely and won't leave much margin for future, more demanding games. I do plan to finish this build by March 2020, so unless a 5800 XT is announced then I will stick with my original pick.
According to Buildzoid the reference PCB is a very over-engineered design, which is encouraging.
Most of the aftermarket designs also extend too high above the PCI slot, not leaving room for the waterblock fittings/hoses.
Not only is the Sapphire reference card the cheapest available, they also have a history of producing some of the best AMD cards.
Note: I've put 'TBC' in the hopes that AMD announces a more powerful card at CES in January - although the 5700 XT meets my performance target, it does it just barely and won't leave much margin for future, more demanding games. I do plan to finish this build by March 2020, so unless a 5800 XT is announced then I will stick with my original pick.
When it comes to PCIe Gen4 SSD's, the only design available at the moment is the Phison E16 controller pared with Toshiba 96-layer NAND. There's the Gigabyte with a terrible cooler design (despite being solid copper), the Corsair, Sabrent and Seagate. The Sabrent has a hell of a cooler design, but there's no room for it with my rear mounted M.2 slot, and most other motherboards come with a M.2 heatsink anyway.
Also, of these options only Seagate is a proven manufacturer of HDD's and SSD's. Seagate is also the only manufacturer to develop it's own optimized firmware rather than the reference Phison firmware. For me, the icing on the cake is that Seagate are also the only brand that provides SSD software for Linux!
To compliment this drive, I will use the QNAP M.2 Heatsink (https://shop.qnap.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=168)
NAND actually lasts longer when drive writes are done at over 40° C, so I only want to cool the controller. I also only have 5-6mm clearance between the M.2 drive and the case panel.
Also, of these options only Seagate is a proven manufacturer of HDD's and SSD's. Seagate is also the only manufacturer to develop it's own optimized firmware rather than the reference Phison firmware. For me, the icing on the cake is that Seagate are also the only brand that provides SSD software for Linux!
To compliment this drive, I will use the QNAP M.2 Heatsink (https://shop.qnap.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=168)
NAND actually lasts longer when drive writes are done at over 40° C, so I only want to cool the controller. I also only have 5-6mm clearance between the M.2 drive and the case panel.
When it comes to memory, I always use G.Skill since their TridentZ range is made up of cherry-picked chips and have excellent timings.
I don't want to muck around with overclocking, and their Neo sub-brand is tested for compatibility with Ryzen CPU's and motherboards.
Because I don't want to overclock or spend a ridiculous amount of money on RAM, I'm opting for the model with 16-19-19-39 timings.
This uses Hynix J/CJR die rather than their tip spec Samsung B die, but isn't far off in performance.
3600MHz is almost the fastest you can go (3733) using the 1:1 Ryzen InfinityFabic ratio, so it's my best off-the-shelf option.
I don't want to muck around with overclocking, and their Neo sub-brand is tested for compatibility with Ryzen CPU's and motherboards.
Because I don't want to overclock or spend a ridiculous amount of money on RAM, I'm opting for the model with 16-19-19-39 timings.
This uses Hynix J/CJR die rather than their tip spec Samsung B die, but isn't far off in performance.
3600MHz is almost the fastest you can go (3733) using the 1:1 Ryzen InfinityFabic ratio, so it's my best off-the-shelf option.
For power supplies, I considered 3 brands; Seasonic, Silverstone and Corsair. I consider Seasonic to be the best power supply manufacturer, and of those 3 options they are the only OEM.
Silverstone does have some decent options using High Power as the OEM, but they measure 125x130mm - which is 5mm longer than it needs to be on one side!
Corsair seem to get rave reviews, and their smaller SFX rather than SFX-L form factor is compelling. However, on further research they use Great Wall as their OEM!! No thank you!
This leaves Seasonic, my preferred brand anyway, and they just announced their 800W Titanium (STX) and Platinum (SPX) SFX-L power supplies at Computex 2019.
These measure 125x125mm exactly, and use a 120x15mm fan. The 800W provides a comfortable margin for my build.
Note: I've put 'TBC' as they are not yet available for purchase. Given the March 2020 timeframe for my build, if they do not become available in time then I will be going with the Seasonic Focus SGX-650, which is a Gold rated 650W model in the same range.
Silverstone does have some decent options using High Power as the OEM, but they measure 125x130mm - which is 5mm longer than it needs to be on one side!
Corsair seem to get rave reviews, and their smaller SFX rather than SFX-L form factor is compelling. However, on further research they use Great Wall as their OEM!! No thank you!
This leaves Seasonic, my preferred brand anyway, and they just announced their 800W Titanium (STX) and Platinum (SPX) SFX-L power supplies at Computex 2019.
These measure 125x125mm exactly, and use a 120x15mm fan. The 800W provides a comfortable margin for my build.
Note: I've put 'TBC' as they are not yet available for purchase. Given the March 2020 timeframe for my build, if they do not become available in time then I will be going with the Seasonic Focus SGX-650, which is a Gold rated 650W model in the same range.
I hope this has been an interesting and/or informative post. Stay tuned for more info and PICTURES!
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