Cooling [Linus] Graphite Thermal Interface Sheet from IC

VegetableStu

Shrink Ray Wielder
Original poster
Aug 18, 2016
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Was wanting to necro the last thread on the similar topic, but thought I post this instead


35W/mK vertically
800~800,000W/mK planar (??? OEM unsure)

Performs within 1 degree centigrade vs IC diamond (they're the same IC by the way)
THROW AWAY ALL YOUR GOOP

bummer they're not in stock. and they don't have larger sheets

Official page: https://www.innovationcooling.com/products/ic-graphite-thermal-pad/
 

Phuncz

Lord of the Boards
SFFn Staff
May 9, 2015
5,947
4,952
I'm interested by this, as I regularly swap coolers on a build and not needing to reapply sounds amazing. Though I'm not sure how man-handling it will affect performance, since Linus already seemed to have made a crease or two in the sheet. I worry that creases will affect performance considerably.
 

Julio Espinosa

Caliper Novice
Jul 17, 2017
31
23
I was thinking of soldering a CPU to a cooler, to reach the best cooling performance possible.
But this is awesome!

I've had very good performance with my Indium foil. Also, it's thinner than the graphite, and as a metal, conductivity has to be pretty darn close to that stuff.
Do you have more Info?
I would like to know more about it
 
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dumplinknet

Airflow Optimizer
Jan 26, 2018
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Testifier

Average Stuffer
Oct 16, 2017
55
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Then I think the one we should look at is the "EYG-S" series, for instance, EYG-S1516ZLSB.

This is a "Compressable" type, rated at 28 W/m-K and is 2mm thick, which is very close (also look almost the same in term of the material surface). I believe the difference is due to the actual thickness difference between the two. If the one sold by innovation cooling has 2.5mm thickness and the math scale proportionally, we'll have 28 / 2 * 2.5 = 35
 

theGryphon

Airflow Optimizer
Jun 15, 2015
299
237
Then I think the one we should look at is the "EYG-S" series, for instance, EYG-S1516ZLSB.

This is a "Compressable" type, rated at 28 W/m-K and is 2mm thick, which is very close (also look almost the same in term of the material surface). I believe the difference is due to the actual thickness difference between the two. If the one sold by innovation cooling has 2.5mm thickness and the math scale proportionally, we'll have 28 / 2 * 2.5 = 35

That math is just a coincidence. No way thermal conductivity works like that. Technically, thermal conductivity should decrease with thickness, ceteris paribus.

I found this one over at Aliexpress, and I am buying one to see what this fuss is about :)

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/200...-Between-STB-C-and-heat-sink/32236008362.html

0.8mm, compressible, 180 W/m-K thermal conductivity.
 

theGryphon

Airflow Optimizer
Jun 15, 2015
299
237
https://static6.arrow.com/aropdfconversion/ccc3d36664263a422f2642af36cb8c721ddcd39e/2aya0000c21.pdf

And yet, according to Panasonic’s datasheet, the thermal conductivity increases with the thickness. That might also explain why the planar thermal conductivity is so high compared to z-axis


Hmmmm, that graph shows thermal "resistance" which is exact inverse of thermal conductivity. So, yeah, physics is never wrong (almost?) ;)


EDIT: OK, it seems an explanation is due since that source appears to give contradictory information, while it's not. There is a misuse of terms on my part as well as that source.

To clarify, the thermal conductivity is measured with W/mK and it's the heat transfered per unit time over 1m2 area through a 1m thickness when the temperature differential between the surfaces is 1 K.

Actual heat transfer per unit time (e.g. Watts) depends on area and thickness, and it increases with area but decreases with thickness.

The source refers to m^2.K/W as "thermal resistance" but it's more correctly referred to as thermal insulance.

On the other hand, the reciprocal of thermal conducitvity is actually called thermal resistivity (mK/W), and it is different from thermal insulance and thermal resistance (K/W).

Basically, thermal resistance considers the area and thickness of the material, while thermal insulance considers only the thickness, whereas thermal resistivity considers neither.

As a result, a thicker (e.g. 3mm) material can have higher thermal insulance (m^2.K/W) AND have higher thermal conductivity (W/mK) at the same time, than a thinner material.

If you call thermal conductivity x and material thickness L, then thermal insulance is L/x, meaning thermal insulance increases with thickness.

Going back, it turns out I was wrong, the 3mm graphite pad does have higher thermal conductivity than a 1mm graphite pad, but at my defense I had thermal conductance in mind. Thermal conductance (inverse of thermal insulance) is the Watts through a particular thickness (when temp diff is 1K). In that respect, I was right too, because a 3mm graphite pad does carry lower Watts than a 1mm pad.

So, we were both right. Case closed :)
 
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EdZ

Virtual Realist
May 11, 2015
1,578
2,107
Hmmmm, that graph shows thermal "resistance" which is exact inverse of thermal conductivity. So, yeah, physics is never wrong (almost?) ;)


EDIT: OK, it seems an explanation is due since that source appears to give contradictory information, while it's not. There is a misuse of terms on my part as well as that source.

To clarify, the thermal conductivity is measured with W/mK and it's the heat transfered per unit time over 1m2 area through a 1m thickness when the temperature differential between the surfaces is 1 K.

Actual heat transfer per unit time (e.g. Watts) depends on area and thickness, and it increases with area but decreases with thickness.

The source refers to m^2.K/W as "thermal resistance" but it's more correctly referred to as thermal insulance.

On the other hand, the reciprocal of thermal conducitvity is actually called thermal resistivity (mK/W), and it is different from thermal insulance and thermal resistance (K/W).

Basically, thermal resistance considers the area and thickness of the material, while thermal insulance considers only the thickness, whereas thermal resistivity considers neither.

As a result, a thicker (e.g. 3mm) material can have higher thermal insulance (m^2.K/W) AND have higher thermal conductivity (W/mK) at the same time, than a thinner material.

If you call thermal conductivity x and material thickness L, then thermal insulance is L/x, meaning thermal insulance increases with thickness.

Going back, it turns out I was wrong, the 3mm graphite pad does have higher thermal conductivity than a 1mm graphite pad, but at my defense I had thermal conductance in mind. Thermal conductance (inverse of thermal insulance) is the Watts through a particular thickness (when temp diff is 1K). In that respect, I was right too, because a 3mm graphite pad does carry lower Watts than a 1mm pad.

So, we were both right. Case closed :)
To make things more complex, these Graphene sheets are anisotropic conductors, which is why they have a ridiculously high conductivity across the plane, but a much lower conductivity along the Z axis (through the plane). They don't behave in the same way as you would expect from a bulk material.
 

tinyitx

Shrink Ray Wielder
Jan 25, 2018
2,279
2,338
Looking just at the CPU temperature numbers, using this does not offer a difference from using the GC Extreme. So, it seems the chief advantage is not a thermal one but ease of use and installation and much longer service life.
 

theGryphon

Airflow Optimizer
Jun 15, 2015
299
237
So, it seems the chief advantage is not a thermal one but ease of use and installation and much longer service life.

Exactly.

It pretty much removes the human factor, improving comparability of performance reviews. The only question remains is how variable the manufacturing process is and how sensitive the performance is to such variability.
 

Kmpkt

Innovation through Miniaturization
KMPKT
Feb 1, 2016
3,382
5,936
I find myself wondering how a trimmed piece of this stuff would do on a delid. While 35 W/mK is obviously half of what liquid metal provides it will be VASTLY better than Intel's goop. The cleanliness, containability (ie won't bleed onto your shit and fry your CPU) and need to never replace seems like it could provide a really great middle ground.

I also find myself wondering if you could make a big bale of these things, adhere them and slice off thin bits that conduct in the 800-80000 W/mK direction : )
 
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jtd871

SFF Guru
Jun 22, 2015
1,166
851
Without being an expert, I suspect that there is a benefit from the relatively higher lateral heat transfer in that the heat goes from the die to IHS, which does a modest job at spreading out the heat, to the graphite (graphene?) pad, which does a tremendous job of spreading out the heat, before it transfers into the heatsink. I think this might do a better job at more evenly transferring the heat to a cold plate than the IHS. I suspect the best use case may be as the TIM between the IHS and heatsink cold plate rather than as the TIM between the die and IHS.
 

VegetableStu

Shrink Ray Wielder
Original poster
Aug 18, 2016
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I also find myself wondering if you could make a big bale of these things, adhere them and slice off thin bits that conduct in the 800-80000 W/mK direction : )

yeah but wouldn't they just conduct better in the fiber direction now? o_o (it'd basically be lining up hairs to make a sheet)
not sure how it works, but a tiny part of me is skeptical

I suspect the best use case may be as the TIM between the IHS and heatsink cold plate rather than as the TIM between the die and IHS.

hmm, running delidded... if one manages to line the entire coldplate with the graphite pad and insulate the SMT transistors around the silicon piece, would it counduct even better?
 
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